Today is February 9, 2006 and you know what that means. It’s time to commemorate the martyrdom of Husayn ibn Ali, the grandson of Muhammad at the Battle of Karbala in the year 61 AH (AD 680). This tradition is better known as Ashura and is very popular amongst Shia Muslims. Many choose to spend the day performing mourning rituals or passion plays re-enacting the martyrdom. While most people march through the streets beating their chest, others emulate the suffering of Husayn by flagellating themselves with chains or cutting their foreheads until blood streams from their bodies.
Related posts:
- Happy Ashura!
- Holy SHi’ITe Kids! Happy Ashura!
- Happy Gai Jatra My Fine Hindu Friends!
- Benny Hinn–Let The Bodies Hit The Floor
- Happy Chrismahanukwanzakah Everyone
February 16th, 2009 at 3:37 am
All the rhetoric is just rhetoric. What is the case for a religion whose prophet (peace be upon Him- i mean no disrespect to you) murdered and justifies the willing murder of Jews? It is evident from history that Islam came into being because one tribe (the tribe of Ishmael) was dishonored by another tribe (tribe of Isaac). I think God exists beyond the ridiculous machinations of weak, pathetic human beings who are seduced by the devil- seduced into thinking they are right and others are wrong. God’s intent is for everyone to live in peace and harmony, but the Shaitan corrupted from the beginning.
February 4th, 2009 at 2:45 am
one more question for specially shia muslim. what exactly do u mean by holy?
what is holy?
thank u for guiding me. if you define holy i promise to be muslim again and cut my head in ashura and maybe everyday.
Farhad from Tabriz
February 4th, 2009 at 2:41 am
Plz help me. evidence from modern cosmology and evolutionary biology show no evidence of god. so why should i believe that 1400 years ago a mentalist named Moahhamad with limited mind discovered god and became his prophet.or where should i know from that what he said is true. the only thing that we have as a judge is humanity and concise. so if anyone doesnt bother anyone else and doesnt discriminate anyones ennoblement,so why does he/she requires religion. of course my definition is not complete,but is the best that we have for now.
January 18th, 2009 at 1:11 pm
Shias are true followers of the Prophets sunnat ie true muslims
January 13th, 2009 at 5:04 pm
Imran Azmi, a couple of points about your post:
1. You said that there is prohibition by Islam of this because, for one reason,
However, if that is the case, why not just let nature and logic suffice? Why is religion edict even necessary to conclude that cutting one’s forehead is a bad idea? (hint: it isn’t necessary, and you have pretty much said so without being willing to go the distance to the conclusion).
2. In what you also said,
that is easily accepted, but reasonable laws and verdicts can be arrived at without Islam (or any other religion). The Islamic ideology is easily shown to be invalid for other reasons, such as its self-contradictions and the all-too-human weaknesses of its (man-made) god.
So why not just abandon the religion? Reason is sufficient in assessing the present case re Ashura bloodletting.
January 13th, 2009 at 10:29 am
Dear all
This is an act done by some ignorant Shia’s. As per the verdicts of the Shia religous leaders, and specifically the Supreme Leader Ayatullah Khamenei, this act is totally prohibited for 3 reasons, 1> it is against human innate nature and logic 2> it was not way the children and infallible progeny of Hussain ibn Ali mourned on him 3> it makes a mockery of Islam.
In every religion and society there are people who break laws. There are theives , rapists, drunkards who give a bad name to a society where these acts are prohibited by laws. Hence not following the laws and verdicts does not mean the system or the ideology is wrong, it is a problem with the people who are not understand and applying. God willing these things will soon be recitifed and Islam will be presented to the world very soon in its purified form which has already started to happen after the Islamic Revolution in Iran in 1979 and the stand of Hizbullah.
Imran
January 13th, 2009 at 8:46 am
this is an answer to farhad for his comments on the holy prophet and his holy progeny , 1st of all woe to u for being ashamed of urself as a muslim!!!! being blessed to live in the holy city of iran yet u dont realise how blessed you are! and then again how dare you beignborn as a muslim u speak so disrespectfully about theholy prophet imam ali and lady fatimah??? there has to be something wrong with you mentallyyy !!! wake up before its too late follow teh right creed before you regret in the grave wehre there will be no return !!as far as the day of asshura is concerened every muslim and non muslim is very well aware of the tragedy faced by the holy families…its very sad to see that you are strongly against it. very true when it comes to extremist as i call them who are ignorant and unaware of the actual fact behind commamorating the day of ashura, but for these few illiterate and ignorant people you have no rights to blame the whole shia world!! would you accept to be called a terrorist as the world terms every muslim now???? open your eyes wider before its too late .. to 1 and every muslim who is aware and pretending to be unaware of his/her own faith …wake up before u r woken up!!!
January 7th, 2009 at 2:59 pm
But these are good because buy these kind of praying the universe will get clean of them.we need Edvard Witten ,Uzeyir Hajibeyov(Great Azerbaijan composer),new Einsteins ,…if Uzeyir will go to hell and Mohammad to heaven,i prefer to go to hell.at least i can listen to his great symphonies,i can talk to Einestein. i can attend in witten’s class in the middle of fires.
January 7th, 2009 at 2:47 pm
Thank you for this site, i am an Iranian 30 years old theoretical physics student from tabriz,Iran’s 3rd largest city and i am absolutely ashamed of myself to be muslim,specialy for being sheia.don’t think that these freaks are artificial. superstition is in the heart of Islam.
Islamic leaders and fake prophets were wild and idiot humanoids. specially Mohammad Ali and 18 years old girl named Fatima.
January 7th, 2009 at 4:21 am
I am Shei3yi and i am proud of being student of karbala school where we learn a lot from it,this who we are we can give our blood for the name of imam al hussein,we are the brave and strong people in south of lebanon ,we dont fear from death because we are the beloved people of imam hussein ,and for rida(345) i want tell him that the donky is really who mention these words and wrote them not the shi3a idiot man ,shi3a are the people who keeps always the head of Arabic countries up not like egypt and saudi arabia ya foolish .
December 23rd, 2008 at 4:46 am
look i am muslim too..this was weird..
November 30th, 2008 at 4:16 am
well what u r seeing is actually not this…
we are proud to be a followers of IMAM HUSSAIN a.s. and FUCK OFF the whole bloody ass wholes world!!
October 4th, 2008 at 1:46 am
Bismillah Ar Rahman Ar Rahim,
(In the name of God, the most Beneficent & the most Merciful.)
Deal gently with a people, and be not harsh; cheer them and condemn not. Holy Prophet (PBUH)
One who says unpleasant things about others, will himself quickly become a target of their scandal. Ali bin Abutalib (A.S.)
If I cut a faithful Muslim into pieces to make him hate me, he will not turn into my enemy and if I give all the wealth of this world to a hypocrite to make him my friend he will not befriend me. It is so because the Holy Prophet has said: ” O Ali! No faithful Muslim will ever be your enemy and no hypocrite will ever be your friend. ” Ali bin Abutalib (A.S.)
A bedouin came to the holy prophet Muhammad (s) and asked him some questions.
Bedouin: I wish to be the richest person in the world.
Prophet: Be content and you will be the richest person in the world.
Bedouin: I would like to be the most learned of people.
Prophet: Fear Allah and you will be the most learned of people.
Bedouin: I would like to be the most just of people.
Prophet: Desire for others what you would like for yourself and you would be the most just of people.
Bedouin: I would like to be the best of people.
Prophet: Be good to others and you will be the best of people.
Bedouin: I would like to be the most honorable of people.
Prophet: If you do not complain to any fellow humans you will be the most honorable of people.
Bedouin: I wish to be safe from Allah’s Wrath on the Day of Judgment.
Prophet: If you do not lose your temper with any of your fellow humans, you will be safe from Allah’s wrath on the Day of Judgment.
Bedouin: What are the worst evils in the sight of Allah?
Prophet: Hot temper and miserliness (i.e. selfishness with money).
Wassalam.
July 25th, 2008 at 1:11 am
hi im a muslim im not a shia im a sunni i think these people are very stupid , donkeys in other words they do things that should’t be done , this is the kinda stuff that makes islam look bad everyone shud be (muslim) no shia or sunni or everyone shud be sunni cause shais are crazy people and kill and bomb people
June 7th, 2008 at 3:08 am
And no one can be a bad person if they offer tea and biscuits . . . how very Bedouin of you (a high compliment, I assure you)! :)
June 7th, 2008 at 2:57 am
Muslim boy —
I don’t mean to fry synapses during exams ;) and I am well aware that you are a teenager. Let me share a favorite saying (I’m full of them; one might say that I live my life by sayings and quotations) from my most honored “holy” book, “Stranger in a Strange Land”: “I will wait until waiting in fullness is.” In other words, patience is my watchword (and a very hard-won one at that, I freely admit). I am very happy to hear that your mind is not closed to new ideas; it is one of the wonders of adolescence that all to often ossifies into hard-line thinking with no flexibility. I myself try to be open to new modes of thought, even though I have some hard-wired responses to certain ideas I have heard again and again (for example, the concept of original sin, which seems to me the greatest evil ever propogated upon humanity after due and careful consideration: there is no logical reason whatsoever to blame and punish a one-day old unbabtized baby for the crimes of remote ancestors!).
I could go into the root religions which fed into the Abrahamic ones, but I am a firm believer that self-actualization requires one to do research and study on one’s one. Still, I’ll give you a hint: archeological history indicates that Abraham was in Egypt at the exact same time as the initial concept of a monotheistic god was posited by Ahnkesenaten (father of Tutahnkamen, the only pharoah with an intact treasure found from the 20th century on) . . . which says volumes.
June 6th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
kurt..
a very interesting point,
i dont know if i speak for all abrahamic religions, but for islam it is neccessery for both the good and the bad to be present within one’s self…
the whole idea is that are you able to control your anger, and prevent say anger from clouding your ability to act logically at times..
we want this freewill, we dont want to be puppets and have no control over our destiny..
the whole idea is god is merciful enough to have given us life and to have allowed us to choose what actions to carry out and ultimately if we are worthy of heaven and hell.. the good and the bad must be seperated (i.e punishment and reward) otherwise, the whole idea of morality would collapse..
yesterday, these 2 christian ladies from a local church came knocking on my door.. i opened the door, saw the bibles in their hands and understood the situation immidiatly.. i decided rather than to tell them to go away as most people usually do, i told them i was al ears and willing to listen to what they had to say.. i told them i was muslim and we had a discussion. since im still busy with exams i asked if they could come back when id finished and we could have a proper discussion (with tea and biscuits), because this is not only an oppurtunity for them to try and influence me to embrace christianity, but for me to express my beliefs and hopefully have a significant effect upon them…
kurt i really dont think ive got the right knowledge to deal with those sorts of question, i only just about know my religion enough to be able to understand its basic beauty.. but theres far more i still have to learn. i got a free bible off those ladies, gonna read through it and compare it to the holy quaran. hopefully sooner or later, ill be able to properly answer your questions mate, for now your dealin with a teenager.
my lord is merciful..
June 5th, 2008 at 5:16 pm
Muslim boy –
Hope you did well on your exams, and welcome back!
Actually, that point was one that I have heard, and it goes along nicely with what Irish was pointing out. My actual thoughts on the matter go something like this: *all* of our emotions serve an evolutionary purpose. Lust aids in the mating process, anger is useful for defending oneself, etc.; all through the release of hormones. As a scientific agnostic, I tend most towards deism as a proper model for what is seen to occur in this Universe, with a dash of Buddhism and Taoism thrown in. I don’t see any evidence that any “god” which inititated the Universal processes has intervened at all since initiation (the Big Bang).
These things must be balanced: cooperation is good for many things, but has its limits; the same can be said for competition. To actively forbid any emotion we have as completely “evil” is a manichean view of the Universe — black vs. white — when it is in fact made of shades of gray.
And yet the Abrahamic religions *do* posit a black vs. white view, and promise punishment for *thought* as well as action. I just can’t subscribe to that.
As far as free will, I do believe it exists, but there is something to be said for the argument that from outside, everything looks deterministic; from the inside it looks like free will.
Hope all is well with you and yours.
June 5th, 2008 at 6:17 am
im a good 2 months late..
had exams..
kurt, so u are saying you would rather god didnt put this lust and whatever, and that you didnt have the freewill to refrain from sinning, but rather for god to control your life..
that is what you are suggesting is it not?
you dont want these bad qualities because you think its unfair…
but without them you would be ‘all good’ with no freewill to be bad, and hence youd just be a puppet…
think about it
April 4th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
Irish —
I’m surprised you didn’t bring up one of the most cogent arguments concerning this aspect I’ve ever heard: if we have been created, we were created with all our emotions, flaws, and urges. So here we have a god who *makes* man lustful, jealous, and violent, and then says “don’t do that!” Makes one wonder, that little theological point, doesn’t it?
By the way, no offense Muslim boy, but that is something which the Abrahamic religions have some serious explaining to do. One of the reasons I am not an adherent.
April 4th, 2008 at 6:25 pm
“islam as a religion, encourages the performance of the good deeds and prohibits the morally bad.”
What does that imply about us as humans? So we would all be robbing, murdering, and raping if it weren’t for someone telling us those things are wrong? Thats the most pessimistic view of mankind I have ever heard.
By the way, I truly LOATHE all things that have caused death and destruction at any time in history. It just so happens religion falls into that category.
April 4th, 2008 at 5:50 pm
@muslimboy
let’s start with the creation account, as stated in the quran. it’s quite similar to genesis, maybe even more vague. that kind of creationism is proven to be inaccurate.
April 4th, 2008 at 5:29 pm
“in the name of Allah, the all-merciful, the comapsionate”
thank you all for your posts, really helpful..
it is completely understandable why you are in the position you are in (i.e athiests)
from what i have understood so far..
*your position, is similar to mine. i believe in one god rather than to believe in many, as for you, you believe of none rather than 1.
*Muslims are being mocked because you feel your freedom of speech is at cost and therefore by doing so you are showing that you choose to use that freewill to do so.
boris: regardimg your point on morality…
islam as a religion, encourages the performance of the good deeds and prohibits the morally bad. the religion its self is perfectly moral, but it is some muslimeen who choose to interpret it to suit them or even to the extent where they disregard what it mentions and become ‘immoral’ people.
the moral system of any society will fail if those who perform the ‘bad deeds’ are not punished and those who do the ‘good’ are not rewarded. that is the basic principle of it all.
alcari: please name me aspects of the holy quran which have been proven to be false. not the aspects which are debatable (i.e the xistence of god), but those of which cannot not be true due to firm proof against.
since parts of teh quran we understand to be correct (more than basic observations, but scientific references) then surely the parts mankind are unable to understand (e.g the idea of a hereafter) are true as well.
sid, thank u for that..
i read the post and it is a good response.
but to an extent, i think it is merely to show off your ability to mock is it not? by mocking islam you are basically saying ‘ i have freewill to do as i like and i choose to annoy you (muslims) buy supporting these cartoons and to watch you get angry’
i will be honest, if i were to be under the influence of an athiest upbringing, i quite possibly might have had completely different opinions to what i ahve now. however, i have pased the stage where my parents have an influence upon my fundemental belief. i am old enough to balance the evidence for god with the evidence against.
personally, i believe the evidence for is stronger than the evidence against
here are a few points:
many athiests have argued
“if god was merciful, evil would not exist”
I do not agree with the above statement. Personally, I believe that without evil, good could not exist because both elements are dependant upon each other. There are reasons for evil to be present and from a religious perspective, if evil was not present then the whole idea of a hereafter would be destroyed and the purpose for our existence would be questioned.
There are many factors separating the hereafter from this life. Looking at it at a fundamental level, one will see that the hereafter consists of a ‘hell’ which is all bad for us (therefore unbeneficial for mankind) and a heaven which is the oxymoronic element of hell and thus ‘all-good’ and therefore a reward to mankind.
According to Christian belief, God is testing our faith by allowing all these evils to take place. Patience is a key factor to success, besides loyalty (i.e. to not leave your religion) and thanking God even when a misfortune befalls them.
It is understandable why people deny God as being merciful or even to deny his existence completely. As human beings our intellect is limited. We constantly ask unanswered questions and due to our limited intellect are unable to come to a firm conclusion whereby science and religion are not conflicting and the degree of certainty is relatively dominant compared to the level of uncertainty.
Moral evil is due to human ignorance and lack of morality (obviously). As for natural evil, the benefits are heavily outweighed by the negative aspects. For example, an earthquake does more ‘bad’ than ‘good’. As for Volcanoes, their eruptions are necessary for the renewal of minerals in the soil but their effects, potentially, could be devastating.
I believe that there would be no point in an afterlife if evil did not exist in this life. For me to have firm belief in a hereafter, rationally, life must have a purpose and work as a form of testing our faith and testing if we are worthy of a positive hereafter or not.
as you know, evil has 2 forms: natural and moral (caused by us)
the natural evil is a part of nature, and only causes damage to a certain dgree. natural evil (i.e tidal waved, tsunamis, volcanic eruptions etc) all have their purposes.
as for moral evil, it is the fault of man, and justice wil be served.
The perfect harmony of creation around us points to an existence of a creator. Can such beautiful and sophisticated creations, from single celled amoeba to the complex brain of man, have evolved by chance? There must be reason behind this. ‘Luck’ and ‘chance’ are not good enough to explain our creation. The very idea of an all-powerful creator who we submit to cements morality and allows society to run morally.
Everything occurs due to a cause- there is cause and effect. Bertrand Russell once said that he would believe in God, if only he understood who had caused God to come into existence. Although the discussion about this is a bit complicated, we understand there is a need for an Ultimate cause or an ‘uncaused cause’ to work as a trigger. This is necessary; otherwise if we imagine a being created God we must ponder over what created that being. It therefore follows that there must be a cause that has not been an ‘effect’ of something else.
It is understandable why atheists do not believe in a ‘God’. In order to believe in something evidence must be present to support the claim. However, different people view something as either being evidence or not. For example, a fundamental piece of evidence for Muslims is the Qu’ran and as for Christians, the bible.
For example, people who see things describe it as being evidence. However, there are many things we do not see but we know exist. Examples include atoms and gravity. However we understand they exist due to their effects. In that respect, I think that believing in God should be more based on a scientific judgement as well as evidence in religion rather than based on the fact that there is many people believing in his exists.
i hope ive made it a bit clearer why i believ god exists and why i believe it is vital for there to be a perfect Judical system where god will be ‘the best of judges’.
i would like to thank you all for your time, pleasure debating with you lot, ive learnt so much about the athiest perspective and this site has also allowed me to analyse my curent position in islamic belief and why it is important for me to continue challanging those who represent islam negatively and terrorise and kill under the banner of islam and use their religion as an excuse to commit horrible crimes…
may Allah have mercy upon us all..
April 4th, 2008 at 4:50 pm
i am soo annoyed!!!
i spent ages writing apost but when i posted it i had forgotton to write my name and therefore my post was not posted!!!!!!!
i will reply, thank you all anyway, been really helpful
April 4th, 2008 at 3:38 pm
Hello muslim boy,
As always, I appreciate your well-mannered comment and tolerant nature.
You may have missed it, but I made a comment earlier on a different post that may help explain why some atheists (and others) mock Islam. You can find my comment at this link.
I know that you posed this question to irishthunder, so I hope that neither you nor he mind if I answer for myself. I happen to have a weak belief in a god, but I presume you mean “What would it take for you to believe in the God of Abraham?” For all of the categories you suggest (visual evidence, etc.), the answer would be ‘depends’. It depends on the quality of the evidence, the amount of evidence, and how well various pieces of evidence all fit together. I use the principle known as Sagan’s Balance: Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Allah is extremely extraordinary, falling completely outside everyday experience. Thus my belief in such a being would require quite a bit of extraordinary evidence.
I think that boris and Alcari answered this point quite ably. I’ll add just one thing. Think about all the reasons you completely remove any god other than Allah as a possibility, then you would understand why we remove Allah as a possibility.
I agree on both accounts. But what I am unwilling to do is to jump from “I don’t know” or “I might have it wrong” to “God must have done it”. It’s an invalid conclusion.
April 4th, 2008 at 3:08 pm
“well if you choose to believe god doesnt exist, then give us our right of he does.”
Proof your belief has some actual basis, and we might give it another thought.
“i don’t mock athiests for failing to acknowledge their lord’s existence, and i would greatly appreciate it if you stopped mocking muslims for their belief in a supreme lord.”
Why? Why shouldn’t we mock your religion? You can go and mock atheism/agnosticism/deism, we have proof on our side, anyone saying otherwise IS a fool.
“what would it take foryou to believe in God?
* visual evidence?
* near death experience?
*a dream maybe?
*Sciene?”
A booming voice from heaven, followed by every single prophecy in the bible/quran coming true, followed by a guided tour through heaven. That MIGHT begin to convince me, though even that is not prof of Allah/Jehove, merely of a powerfull entity.
“i am Intrigued as how athiest (some) are able to completly remove god as a possibility. religion and science dont have to conflict, it is perfectly possible for both to work together.”
We’re able to completely remove the concept of YOUR god from the real of possibilities. We are also able to show the universe doesn’t need a god. Even though we can never show the universe wasn’t created by some Deistic god, there isn’t a shred of evidence for your Allah.
April 4th, 2008 at 12:48 pm
@muslimboy
most atheists don’t dismiss the possibility there is some form of life more powerful then humans. there is no evidence one way or another. myself, i don’t even dismiss that such a being might have influenced human development at some point. but i am not making such a claim either. there is just no evidence.
there are things we CAN dismiss. islam is based on the same basic mythology as christianity and judaism. for each of these 3 religions we can say with great certainty that their holy books are not “of divine origin” and certainly can’t be read literally as truth. the creation stories in the 3 religions are utter non-sense.evolution represents a very comprehensive model of how life developed on earth, and it’s backed up with enormous ammounts of evidence.
the “morality” described in those books is highly dubious and very much in line with the time it was written. people are much more moral NOW than they were in the time of the bible and the koran, because of education and secular influence on various societies (mainly europe).
people are still widely immoral, but it’s much better than a thousand years ago.
without proof, all you have is a bunch of hot air. why do you think muslims are so defensive? why do you think muslims repeat religious process so much? your faith is a house of cards, very fragile. your persecution complex is not unique. christians in the united states have the same problem, even though there are more churches than fast food restaurants (and that says something). noone is persecuting you, but there are a lot of people who won’t stand for all the negative influence that comes from your religion (or any other religion).
April 4th, 2008 at 11:50 am
“In the name of allah, the all-merciful, the compasionate”
wow, irish.t,
u actually hate religion don’t you???
well if you choose to believe god doesnt exist, then give us our right of he does.
i don’t mock athiests for failing to acknowledge their lord’s existence, and i would greatly appreciate it if you stopped mocking muslims for their belief in a supreme lord.
irish.t, what would it take foryou to believe in God?
* visual evidence?
* near death experience?
*a dream maybe?
*Sciene?
i am Intrigued as how athiest (some) are able to completly remove god as a possibility. religion and science dont have to conflict, it is perfectly possible for both to work together.
as hard as we try, it is unlikely that us human beings will be able to answer all unanswered questions correctly due to our limited intellect.
ya Allah, guide these athiests to the correct path. For surely you are all-powerfull my lord…
April 3rd, 2008 at 4:19 pm
“Just because a few people do something wrong, you have NO RIGHT whatsoever to say that ALL Shiites are MURDERERS or anything disrespectful!”
Actually yes, we do have the right to say whatever we like.
“It doesn’t matter what sect you are, you are Muslims.”
1. No we arent
2. I’ll extend that statement a tad:
It doesn’t matter what religion you are, you are humans. Anything that can be used as another excuse to hate each other and divide us should be wiped out of society, all religions fall into this category.
April 3rd, 2008 at 3:33 pm
I don’t know who started this website and what his/her purpose was, but as a shia who lives in the United Sates, I am ashamed to see such comments from HUMAN BEINGS!!! Yes, I agree that if these pictures are true, it is not what Islam and Imam Hussain came for. Imam Hussain did not give his life for us to misrepresent Islam! However, I am ashamed as a human being to read these overgeneralizations. Just because a few people do something wrong, you have NO RIGHT whatsoever to say that ALL Shiites are MURDERERS or anything disrespectful! You know why Jews and Christians are so united? Because they come together, help each other everywhere, and fight whoever stands on the other side! I have never seen 2 Jews or 2 Christians fight over these things. It’s sad to see that most of you are muslims and are wasting your time by fighting each other, instead of reading and UNDERSTANDING the holy Quran so you can show others the true side of Islam. Try to find similarities and get closer to eachother, rather than finding differences and killing each other!
I don’t know how I came across this site, and I will never come back, but I couldn’t leave without saying these. I really am ashamed as a human being to hear that MUSLIMS call each other murderers. It doesn’t matter what sect you are, you are Muslims.
I will not be back to see your comments, but I hope you stop those who are misrepresenting Islam; this is your mission, NOT KILLING EACH OTHER!
May Allah (swt) have mercy upon all of us.
Fi amanillah
February 3rd, 2008 at 8:19 pm
“” no one is forcing you to do anything, for all i care you can go and waste your life but as for me i choose to put purpose in my life and not be ignorant like youa nd actually praise my creator.. “”
Oh, this is just comedy gold. As scientist say: ‘you’re not even wrong’.
“” if youve bothered to read the quaran you will find many scientific references and since they are true you should believe the other things the quran states such as there being a god and a hereafter “”
Yes, and because the Silmarillion tell some thruths, like the fact that there are stars and the rivers flow into the ocean, we should definatly believe the whole universe was creating by singing demi-gods.
I sense a slight problem with your reasoning.
February 2nd, 2008 at 4:16 pm
“if you have studied islam even at a fundemental level you will find that it completely opposes what these terrorists are doing this present day…”
I have read the Quran, what I learned from it was how similar it is to the christian bible, it really isn’t special. As far as terrorists, it doesn’t matter if only a handful of people interpret it in that fashion, it still means the world will be better off without it. In regard to criticizing your religion, if your faith cant handle some mild dissent then there you should reevaluate your faith.
February 2nd, 2008 at 12:29 pm
in the name of allah, the all merciful, the compasionate
@irishthunder
im not gonna waste muy time on you because you seem to enjoy critisising my religion…
if you have studied islam even at a fundemental level you will find that it completely opposes what these terrorists are doing this present day…
islam is a way of life in which we follow what our lord has commanded of us…
no one is forcing you to do anything, for all i care you can go and waste your life but as for me i choose to put purpose in my life and not be ignorant like youa nd actually praise my creator..
as hard as you may try science will not be able to replace islam. if youve bothered to read the quaran you will find many scientific references and since they are true you should believe the other things the quran states such as there being a god and a hereafter…
whatever you wish to do many god bless youa nd have mercy upon us all :)
February 2nd, 2008 at 6:20 am
“my point is simply that not all muslims are murderers”
But some of them are, so the world will be better off without them.
“it is far easier to critisise than to understand.”
Yes it is, like bitching whenever someone speaks against your religion.
“and honestly there is no need for you to be so disrespectful due to your lack of knowledge”
Actually, if you had as much knowledge as most of the people on here you would not be muslim, or it least you’d understand that you don’t have the right to not be offended.
“and it is quite ironic that you assume that we are not freethinkers, i have done my researcha nd i undersatnd why truely islam is beatiful…”
Because you’ve done research, you have no excuse for following any religion, let alone one as horrible as islam. Have you ever tried scientology?
February 2nd, 2008 at 5:55 am
and another thing is that dont stereotype because not all men are savages who constantly beat their wives, anyone can claim to be a muslim but very few actually follow the religion as they should therefore not killing innocent people….
and it is quite ironic that you assume that we are not freethinkers, i have done my researcha nd i undersatnd why truely islam is beatiful…
“And the life of this world is nothing but play and amusement. But far better is the house in the Hereafter for those who are God-fearing. Will you not then understand?â€
Surah Al-Anam verse 32
February 2nd, 2008 at 5:46 am
in the name of allah, the all merciful, the compasionate
@jayman…
you have freewill to do as you please…
my point is simply that not all muslims are murderers and there is a minority who actually follow what their religion asks of them…
it is far easier to critisise than to understand. and honestly there is no need for you to be so disrespectful due to your lack of knowledge, as i said before go wasteyour life blindly if you wish… but as for me i want to have purpose in my life and follow the path of my beloved prophet and his houshold. may allah have mercy upon us all
“Surely amnkind is at loss (2) except for those who believe and do the good deeds, and enjoin upon each other truth and enjoin upon each other patience (3)- surat al asr(103)
January 31st, 2008 at 6:15 pm
So you would ’spare’ (give?) your life and your family for a dead relative of a murderous warlord paedophile who has a self-proclaimed divine connection with a sky ‘god’?
i rest my case.
I do feel sad for humanity that so many of you have been brainwashed by this inheritantly violent, negative religion, and you will never truly ’see the light’ and be able to think for yourself. And you will also never understand this.
January 31st, 2008 at 5:40 pm
to muslim boy
بسم الله الرØمن الرØيم
ولا تسبوا الذين يدعون من دون الله Ùيسبوا الله عدواً بغير علم.كذلك زينا لكل أمة عملهم ثم إلى ربهم مرجعهم Ùينبئهم بما كانوا يعملون
سورة الانعام الاية 108
as Jayman said “ive got morals in my finger nail than mohammed ever had”
so stopping this conversation with these people is much better than having our prophet and his family (PBUT) being humiliated by unrecpctful people like Jayman.
And to add on I’m proud to be a sheii and I would spare my life and family for Immam Hussain …
(bi aby anta wa ummy ya hussain)
January 29th, 2008 at 1:43 am
how did i miss this?!
muslim boy:
“and as for jayman, u can go waste your life getting drunk and not believing in a creator. because there is going to be an afterlife and you will be judged on your actions. my lord is merciful, that he has deemed mankind worthy to live and to be tested. there is purpose in our lives and we must live our life in an ordertly manner and refrain from bad deeds, because god is allknowing and knows whats good for you. religion brings morality into lives, id rather be a moral person than soem blind idiot who goes around critisising people for believing in his creator.”
nice one to judge and make false accusations (well muslims love to do that) but i guess your ‘purpose’ in life differs in that you believe the word of an illiterate, immoral, murdering, sexist paedophile simply because as a child you were told to do so. and frankly, i’d prefer to get drunk once in a while (which hurts only me) than bash my wife which is something you guys seem to love doing so much. ive got morals in my finger nail than mohammed ever had. im still yet to work out which religion is more hypocritical and full of holes, islam or christianity. islam definitely has brainwashing, fear, pious-ignorance and violence mastered though.
i know who is ‘blind’ and wasting their life in this conversation. hint: it isnt me.
January 28th, 2008 at 6:22 pm
Rida:
“Jayman i bet u dont even have a religion..ok at least we have a religion we know who has created us and the whole world…and we shall see wen u will be in hell and we muslims in paradise..ok so plz jus dont open ur disgraceful mouth”
No offence, knowing i dont have a religion that wasnt exactly a big leap to make, and you saying “at least we have…” doesnt help your argument. Pity your religion only tells you a STORY of creation (not what actually happened). Keep daydreaming of your virgins waiting for you in paradise, that way hopefully you will be too lazy to become a suicide bomber and hurt innocent people. meanwhile i’ll actually live the one life we have on this planet and do more useful, helpful and good things in a year than you will do in your lifetime.
As long as there are d*ckhead ignorants like you living on this world, ill do whatever i feel like to criticise your racist, bigotted, sexist, genocidal, violent, homophobic, paedophilic and pathetic little pissy religion, its followers and your scumbag of a ‘prophet’:
what a great guy mohammed was! if only i could kill and rape who ever i want, beat my wife and take a 9 year old for a bride… i wouldnt piss on mohammed if he was on fire.
January 28th, 2008 at 2:31 am
Rida,
are you seriously saying that you’re superior to Jayman because you believe in fairytales? HAHAHA
January 27th, 2008 at 8:48 am
*sorry i meant to say why do you think we are the murderers of hussain
January 27th, 2008 at 8:44 am
“in the name of allah, the beneficent, the merciful”
to begin with, rida…
may i ask why u say the shias are the murderers of ali? on his farewell pilgrimige before he died, our beloved prophet muhammed (pbuh) stopped at a place called ghadir khum. there, in the heat of the sun, he stood on the platform and made a speech to the muslim ummah.
“O people, I am a human being. I am about to receive a message from my Lord and I, in response to Allah’s call, (would bid good-bye to you), but I am leaving among you two weighty things: the one being the Book of Allah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allah and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allah and then said: The second are the members of my household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my family.[38].”
“O people, I am a human being. I am about to receive a message from my Lord and I, in response to Allah’s call, (would bid good-bye to you), but I am leaving among you two weighty things: the one being the Book of Allah in which there is right guidance and light, so hold fast to the Book of Allah and adhere to it. He exhorted (us) (to hold fast) to the Book of Allah and then said: The second are the members of my household I remind you (of your duties) to the members of my family.[38].”
Muhammed then raised the hand of Ali and shouted “whos ever’s master i was, then now ali is to them a master - man kuntu mawlah fa hatha aliyun mawlah”
the above quote is confirmed by both shias and sunnis, i asure you i study Islam.
i hate to say this, but after Muhammed (pbuh) passed away, the calipha was stolen from Ali. Umar, Ubu Bakr and uthman were all older than ali and were shocked to see Muhammed favouring him to be the Caliph. Ali was the first male convert to islam. he stood by muhammed (pbuh) through out his life and was loyal to him. as for Umar, Abu Bakr and Uthman they were non believers at one point in their lives.
however, being the patient and pious person ali was, he was patient and waited. at the time of the Umar, Abu Bakr and Uthman, they chose their close friends and relatives in charge of the different cities across the islamic empire. he would pay them morefrom the treasury. Now, when Ali became caliph he changed that, he did what Muhammed used to do and paid everyone equally. he wanted Muawia removed but Muawia refused and fought against Ali.
let us study this now:
Muhammed(pbuh) fought the army of Abu Sufyan who was against islam. Abu sufyans Son Muawiyah fought against Muhammed’s son in law Ali AND mUHAMMED’S GRANDSON AND aLI’S SON hASSAN. Muawiyas son Yazid tehn fought against the grandson of the prophet hUssain and was the reason of hussains martydom. i do not understand why you wish to say that us followeres of ali are the killers, when indeed hussain fought for truth and justice and refused to give alliegence to Yazid who was an evil man. Yazid’s army were the ones who slaughtered Hussain and his army of 72 men at karbala. they were beheaded and their heads taken to Yazid.
Yazid had brainwashed the people of damascus into believing that he was right and these people were enemies of islam. if it were not for Zainab, the granddaughter of the prophet of islam and the sister of hussain to stand up to him and make a speech and spread the message of karbala, we probably would be ignorant and think yazid was a great man and he was the rightful leader. we may a minority my friend, but you will never silence the truth…
allah is the all knowing the all mighty.. only he can judge me and you, so don’t go labelling people like that. dont simply assume that because you are the majority that you are correct.
and as for the salah issue, ill let you know that we learn our way of praying from the prophet and his ahlulbayt. that was the reason they were so important, because after muhammed’s death only they had the right qualities to interpret the quaran and islam. the crossing of the arms was introduced at the time of umar. it was not used by the prophet.
and as for jayman, u can go waste your life getting drunk and not believing in a creator. because there is going to be an afterlife and you will be judged on your actions. my lord is merciful, that he has deemed mankind worthy to live and to be tested. there is purpose in our lives and we must live our life in an ordertly manner and refrain from bad deeds, because god is allknowing and knows whats good for you. religion brings morality into lives, id rather be a moral person than soem blind idiot who goes around critisising people for believing in his creator.
January 27th, 2008 at 5:09 am
well muslimboy, in my school I go to offer my salaah and there are some shia muslim girls who offer salaah in a totally different way why so? Does that mean ur a proper muslim by offering salah in a different way than other muslims??????if 1 out of then muslims are praying that means they are either praying wrong or they are shia….
May Allah bless u
January 27th, 2008 at 5:03 am
Jayman i bet u dont even have a religion..ok at least we have a religion we know who has created us and the whole world…and we shall see wen u will be in hell and we muslims in paradise..ok so plz jus dont open ur disgraceful mouth
January 27th, 2008 at 5:00 am
muslim boy and abeh iam sorry if i have been disrespecting u lot but this the truth…shias had actually murdured Imam hussain…and i meant like these shias in the pics shud go to hell iam sorry if it really hurt u but why do u all curse ur selfves wen ur ancestors have killed the Prophet (P.B.U.H)Yeah And Allah has said that u shouldnt harm urselves then why do they do this and bleed little children????…..Why cant they just be muslims..yea and why donbt they repent and ask for forgiveness from Allah..Allah will forgive..thanks for telling me my mistakes …
May Allah bless u
January 24th, 2008 at 5:59 pm
“I’VE HAD IT WITH THESE MOTHERFUCKNG SNAKES ON THIS MOTHERFUCKING PLANE” (Samuel L. Jackson, “Snakes on a Plane”)
January 24th, 2008 at 5:57 pm
uuh yeah muslim boy,
nice way to crap on about nothing.
and i say DISRESPECT to all pious people (ignorant arseholes) for choosing to blindly believe in fanciful words vocalised by a violent paedophile (in the case of islam), over true rationality, knowledge and human compassion.
and it really isnt worth much more than amusement to us when you write your prayers to allah on this site.
January 24th, 2008 at 5:38 pm
in the name of allah, the all merciful the compasionate”
excuse me ‘rida’ its a common misunderstanding, but shias do not believe in ‘prophet ali’ ok? muhammed rasool allah. dont go badmouthing us like we are not muslims, ali is the rightful successor and muhammed is the final prophet.
we pray according to how the prophet prayed, if you go study islamic history, i believe you will find that the sunni caliphs introduced the crossing of the hands whilst praying and it was never done by the holy prophet of islam (pbuh).
we may be a minority, but we will grow and we will always spread the truth. we are the followwers of the ahlulbayt (the prophet’s family) who have been mentioned in the quaran as being the best of guides. and yet we are still opressed. allaho akbar, my lord you are so merciful and compasionate yet mankind is so ignorant, forgive us of our crimes and guide us to the correct path, for you arethe almighty, the merciful…
and btw, repect to all the pious people out there, regardless of religion, shias and sunnis must unite and put aside their differences, for thta is the only solution…
“Say: I do not ask of you any reward for it but love for my ahlulbayt (near relatives)”
(Surah Shuara (42), Verse 23)
“Allah desires to keep away the uncleanness from you oh ahlulbayt, and to purify you a thorough purifying” 33:33
January 24th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
“I think that these people in the pictures simpley express their sadness in that way- which is not a good thing to me, but its their choice.”
I agree. It is their choice and perfectly okay with me. Weird but okay. People can do whatever they want AS LONG as they do not hurt other people and here is the problem as I see it.
Check the pictures again - there are children on them. These children does not express sadness - they are being harmed.
January 24th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Alcari, i dont force my religion on anyone, unless they simply ask for some info. Please stop saying my religion is “inconsistent”, because you cant say those things about my religion (or any other religion) unless you have information like a Scholor. But i can’t force you to do anything or think in anyway, although i am able to give suggestions.
By the way Alcari, i like your wide vocabulary.
January 24th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Rita, i am shia, and we believe hurting ourself is bad. I have never seen people make themselves bleed. I think that these people in the pictures simpley express their sadness in that way- which is not a good thing to me, but its their choice.
I wanted to tell you rita, you have no right saying we shias should go to hell. If you are muslim, then shame on you for disrespecting your fellow muslim brothers/sisters. I am Shia, but i still respect you sunnies. Many of my friends are sunni, and many are shia. we all respect eachother. By the way, our ancesters didnt “murder” our prophets family! we love Prophet Mohamed, and his son in law Imam Ali and the rest of the family. You guys follow others (other than Prophet Mohameds family.) what ever Yazid and his army did to Imam Husain was very bad. Dont you know the story?
over all, in my religion, i learn to respect others. i respect all religions, especialy different types of muslims. so when i here another muslim speaking badley about others, that is beyond me. I have many harsh words to say, just like you, but i would never let them out.
In the end, say what you want to say. Alhamdulillah (thank god) I am who i am, shia, and i am very proud. if not today, one day you will have different thoughts. as for now, do/think what you wish, a true believer will just nod at you and smile.
January 24th, 2008 at 7:05 am
musiclover this is real. the ashura is real. they beat themselves. not even beat but bleed..I have seen it in pakistan and i couldnt sleep for ages.Mah Allah Bless you.
January 24th, 2008 at 7:02 am
alcari you are totally rite. may Allah bless you and all our lovely muslim brothers and sisters.
January 24th, 2008 at 6:59 am
Zeinab u are totalkly rite.the ashura is part of muharram. muharram is when our prophet P.B.U.H family and neices had been killed by the shias.shikas are another type of muslims.The pictures above show the shias.The ashura is a very sad and mourning period.You can show these ;pics to the people bcoz what the shias are dpoing is wrong. Allah has said that you shouldntb harm yourselves and these people are justb too mad to be muslims. They have a diffewrent salah *(prayer) than sunnis. sunnis are another group of muslims.The shias believe in Prophet Ali the most. which is totally wrong and is a disbeleif and i think definitely that shias are kaafir(disbeleivers)as for the weird habits and beleifs they have.Their ancestors have murdered our Prophets family!No way they are going to get forgiven by Allah.Hell is the only place for them.And its so offwencivve to muslims whoever wrote happy ashura.Lert me share one more thing. Islam is the only rel;igion to whom most of the people have converted to.Islam is all truth..all scientistshave read the Quraan and all of the facts in it are happening.May Allah give you common sense.
January 23rd, 2008 at 8:41 pm
No, I allready know information doesn’t influence you, otherwise you’d see the inconcistencies, both with empirical data and internally, in your religion.
Agreed on that, just don’t force your religion on anyone, and allow them to form the own opinion, objectively and without coercement. Once everyone does that, I’m a happy man.
@ Jane Calm
Yes, and it’s only mildly less horrible, because as far as I know, christians only do it to themselves. I do agree that they are all equally insane.
January 23rd, 2008 at 5:01 pm
catholics and other Christians also use flaggelation. Cathloics also use scapulars and sell them in mainstream catholic magazines. Christians aslo crawl on bloody knees to shrines–its all screwed up not just islam , and I by the way am a pagan
January 23rd, 2008 at 3:41 pm
irishthunder said
“unless you converted, you were probably getting bombarded 24/7 by your family.”
actually, i didn’t convert, and i am not bombarded by my family.
Alcari said “And it wouldn’t be so bad, if your religion of choice wasn’t so horribly wrong, both scientifically and for society as a whole.”
I just wanted to let you know that your information does not influence me one bit, and what ever your opinions are about other beliefs, (let us just say) I clearly think the opposite. think what you want to think
by the definitions of brainwash, it doesn’t nessesarily have to do with religios beliefs.
what makes YOU not “brainwashed”? based on its definition, everyone is brainwashed one way or another (doesn’t have to be religion)
example: i believe my teacher is smart, and i like her teaching styles.
AM I BEING BRAINWASHED BECAUSE I BELIEVE IN WHAT SHE IS TEACHING?
January 23rd, 2008 at 6:55 am
Riight, so you’re saying the thousands of pictures of people injuring themselves are all an elaborate conspiracy to discredit muslims? Tinfoil hat much?
also:
brainwashing: (according to encyclopedia brittanica)
Systematic effort to destroy an individual’s former loyalties and beliefs and to substitute loyalty to a new ideology or power.
Well, that certainly sounds like what religions worldwide do. And it wouldn’t be so bad, if your religion of choice wasn’t so horribly wrong, both scientifically and for society as a whole.
January 22nd, 2008 at 5:48 pm
“people who follow/beleive in their religion are not “brainwashed†you should go try to get real facts from real people about their religion”
THATS the fact he got wrong?
Brainwashing: consists of any effort aimed at instilling certain attitudes and beliefs in a person
So when you went to your mosque or temple, what was that guy upfront doing? Also, unless you converted, you were probably getting bombarded 24/7 by your family.
January 22nd, 2008 at 5:19 pm
Got to be honest… i dont think that is real blood. Any who,
Hey Alcari, i just wanted to say- if you were generally speaking, then i want to get your “facts” straight.
people who follow/beleive in their religion are not “brainwashed” you should go try to get real facts from real people about their religion, and not believe things on the internet. Haters create bad things, so you never know whats real or not.
GOOGLE…come on! LOL
To sum it up, you are the brainwashed one sweety,,,you are.
January 22nd, 2008 at 9:03 am
I’m iranian and shia(proud) ,It’s the first time that I see these scenes and I should say whatever those people are doing is against Islam
January 21st, 2008 at 4:32 pm
what was presented, is a false versipn of Islam. Islam is the religion of peace and healthy.Well this misunderstanding isnot only in Islam,sometimes when a category is so simple, people make it sophisticated. Perhaps Islam and understanding it is alike that.
January 20th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
AHAHAHAHA
You’re a beautifull example of the brainwashing power and indoctrination of religion. You blindly accept whatever your religion tells you (or in this case, what you want to believe), without bothering to check anything. You believe anything, even if it has no bearing on reality.
It is you who has his eyes closed to the world. If you need more then these two pictures, a simple google search is enough.
http://images.google.com/images?q=ashura+blood
January 19th, 2008 at 6:29 pm
okay, who, in their friggin mind, would think that these pics are true??? do you really think there are kids in this world who do that??? look, i am a muslim…but not shia…but i still know alot about Ashura. i think that these pics are photoshopped or something and are fake. everyone is right: islam is not like this..islam is a very clean religion. not screwed up as they all try to make it. get your minds straight.
January 19th, 2008 at 8:25 am
i am muslam and i am shiia i think wat those people are doing is wrong its very bad but that not wat islam has said
January 18th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
im a muslim, a shiite. i should say that what u see in these pictures is absolutely against islam n shiite. what see is totally inane cause our religion makes us take care of bodies. anyway there s another thing i wanted 2 say; i just wonder how stupid one could be to choose a title like this “happy ahura”. the person must have dung in his/her head to be this stupid. [excuse my language]
January 18th, 2008 at 2:51 pm
this people made the islam word go wrong so people can say these muslim people are mad not all muslim are shia we are different i blive there is only one god allah and mohamed is his masenger not like these people making theemselve bleed really is horrible
January 15th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
Hey Mikel,
you said: “what a bunch of ass wipes”…”It would be a much brighter world without the Middle East altogether.”
I Just wanted to say that YOU INFACT are an ASS, and it would be a much brighter world without people like you who talk badley about others, and you dont even know anything about them.
You should refer to this quote:
“Before you criticize people, you should walk a mile in their shoes. That way, when you criticize them, you’re a mile away. And you have their shoes.” -JK Lambert
hope you find some common sense!
January 15th, 2008 at 12:30 pm
Islam is ridiculous, what a bunch of ass wipes. It’s sad that so many of these creatures are so easily led into this life of unconditional hatred and obscene atrocities on mankind. It would be a much brighter world without the Middle East altogether. These people are twisted and misled and will never learn to think of their own free will and function as a compassionate, civilized society. After all, we’re not living in the middle ages.
Cahoots to Religiousfreaks.com for shedding some light on the practices of these basket cases and their brood.
January 14th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Zeinab speaking about parents cutting their children with knives so they bleed:
“What these people are doing in the above pictures is simply wrong.”
Zeinab speaking about people who posts pictures of bleeding children:
“..and shame on whoever posted those pictures. What an ignorant title, “Happy Ahura?â€. You have got to be kidding me. Shame on you !!
May Allah Guide you to the Right Path.”
..and they say atheists are without morale.
January 14th, 2008 at 4:11 am
Says who? What basis do you have to say that they are doing it wrong?
Wooohooo, instant gratification.
Three cheers for Pavlov.
January 13th, 2008 at 10:49 pm
Ashura is not about beating and hurting yourself. What these people are doing in the above pictures is simply wrong. During this period we mourn for the tragedy of Karbala and remember Ahlul Bayt. It has nothing to do with what you make it seem like. Infact, that’s haram and shame on whoever posted those pictures. What an ignorant title, “Happy Ahura?”. You have got to be kidding me. Shame on you !!
May Allah Guide you to the Right Path.
January 13th, 2008 at 10:13 pm
hey Simon, were you able to check out that radiant worship site?
January 13th, 2008 at 10:11 pm
Alcari, i aim to please, i am curious “remain oblivious and amusing”
i find that qoute interesting.
Alcari, if you would just take the time to really understand Jesus and that everyman should love their wife and respect them… within that is the family and as a leader, just like Gasmonso, has responsibilites as a husband and a father.
Alcari, you want to impress your friends here is entertaining and i have to say that you’re a fine gentleman who knows how to use the internet.
Alcair, i praise Christ Jesus for my faith. my faith is leak and not as strong as i like it be. but maybe if you keep telling yourself “i’m laughing at you Hyrocket and keep it up” you will encourage me to give you scripture here.
So will I ever sing praises to your name,
as I perform my vows day after day.
psalm 61:8
January 13th, 2008 at 9:20 pm
Hyrocket I want to thank you
you just made my day. I thought that everyone that oblivious must have died out allread, or didn’t know how to use the internet. Thank you for proving me wrong and providing me with a great source of entertainment. Just remember that I’m laughing at you, not with you.
With any luck, you won’t get this one either, please, remain oblivious and amusing. It seems your purpose in life is to ignorantly provide entertainment for the rest of us.
And you, my cognitally challenged internet user, deserve special kudos for this remark. It was the icing on hyrocket’s cake.
January 13th, 2008 at 5:49 pm
i am shiaa but we dont do this
we feel for imam hussain but we dont cut or selves and make our selves bleed
and also ppl think that all muslims try to do is bring everyone else to islam
i was at a lecture yesterday and thy were talking about this
he told us a story of a younge man called ali who went to a town and broke all the idels they worshipped in this big are of land but he left only 1 the biggest one
so when the idel worshipperes came back they said to ali “who broke all of these idels, was it you”
ali replied back “well im not sure go and ask the bigeest one dosnt he speak to you and protect you so go and ask him who broke the others” see we only try to open people minds not make them convert allah makes them convert we make then open their minds
also islam is the religion that brang women to the higest regards because of everybody else but now what happenes they all say we dont respect women and keep them in the lowest regard
anwaiz just wanted to have my say
so bye
if you want anymore info just email me
a.oss@hotmail.com
thanks
January 11th, 2008 at 1:42 am
Simon, check this intimate devotional by richy clark. i think you might like it? the richy sounds like sting, to me.
http://www.godsipod.com/
radiant worship
January 10th, 2008 at 10:21 pm
Howdy all,
Hyprocket, can i say that it is safe to say that you know Gods that i talk about but continue to deny the truth in your own heart. Deny the fact of the truth that their words will stand for ever.
Cheers
Simon Bond
January 10th, 2008 at 9:16 pm
You’re a true brick, hyrocket. In many senses.
January 10th, 2008 at 8:14 pm
Simon you are funny… how many gods do you follow? Is Irish talking about me or you?
Simon, you words are so neatly put and so elegant in the ways of unlife. You see that, i said unlife because it is the word i chose to use. it is i not of God or of Jesus but what i chose to say.
Simon said, “I implore you. Join me in the light and accept the gifts the true God’s have given us. Rejoice in the happiness that can only be found when one accpets the true God’s into you heart. All you have to do is ask and salvation is yours”.
can i say that it is safe to say that you know God that i talk about but continue to deny the truth in your own heart of the fact of the truth in His words will stand for ever.
Simon, if there is followers of this god you mention they worshipers in darkness.
this is the words i chose because it is i that provkes you to maddness.
Simon, you say that Jesus is the cause of hate that is among us? it is i that has chosen these words to use.
“The blood of your Christ is tainted with all the innocent souls that have been murdered, over the course of history, in his name”.
if i say to biba that there is life it is not me to cast this hatered that you mention in death through the centuries.
If you know the scriptures and the truth in it, you will not say such lies to me.
Simon, you and i have chosen to pick up the sword and put to death the life that is Jesus.
If you have a brother or sister will they not direct your path that keeps you safe? because they love you and you are their sibling that they have been blessed?
Simon, all i can say is bite me bacause i said it and no Æsir and/or Vanir can take the truth in words that i read.
Did i not read your words you typed Simon?
January 10th, 2008 at 7:47 pm
Howdy all,
Hyrocket, still you follow the path of the evil barbarous God of the Christians. Even after you have learnt of the Sacrifice that true Gods shall make on your behalf upon the time of Ragnarök. With the truth placed before you and the lies of the Christians exposed still your heart is dead and your mind is closed. Turn back from the path you have chosen lest ye end up serving the forces of chaos. For when the time of Ragnarök comes, if you find yourself serving the false God of the Christians you will be rent from this world. Your dammned soul will be forced to wander Niflhel and sample it’s assortment of torments for all eternity.
Hyrocket my soul cries out to see you wander down the path of darkness. I cry out to you in hopes that my words may a last help you to see the evil that you serve. Forsake the flase God of the Christians and remove the viel of lies from your eyes. See the truth, the enlightenment and discover your true purpose. The happiness you seek is not the shallow illusion that you have. You will not know what true contentment really is until you accept Æsir and Vanir as God’s. Only then can you understnad the noble sacrifice they will make to ensure a better future for us all.
The blood of your Christ is tainted with all the innocent souls that have been murdered, over the course of history, in his name. As you worship him, their blood has begun to stain your hands. It has begun to sain your soul. Step back from this path of damnation I implore you. Join me in the light and accept the gifts the true God’s have given us. Rejoice in the happiness that can only be found when one accpets the true God’s into you heart. All you have to do is ask and salvation is yours.
Cheers
Simon Bond
p.s. Sorry for all the spelling mistakes
January 10th, 2008 at 7:16 pm
hyrocket, if you feel yourself about to type something about how you have a path and it involves jesus in someway just stop and post something of substance. The only result of those kind of posts is eyes rolling or glazing over, We’ve all heard that shit a million times before.
January 10th, 2008 at 7:08 pm
Biba, i know a path the leads to life in Jesus and faith in him alone is required to be in heaven. Biba, let me show you a plan of salvation in the blood Jesus Christ for you and your family.
January 10th, 2008 at 7:00 pm
toodles
January 10th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
“You should look around this site a little more, try clicking the “About†link up top. Most everyone here doesn’t believe in yours or any god.”
IN THAT CASE
I dont know what in the world im doing on this website anyways…Bye, i’m going to go pray to God because I am a believer.
I feel sorry for everyone that “doesn’t believe in yours or any god.” I might pray for you guys too (jm), hopefully you’ll find yourselves. ;)
January 10th, 2008 at 6:11 pm
“Because, every before has an after.”
Don’t forget, every beginning must have an end.
“but the concept of your purpose is wrong.”
If my concept is wrong what makes yours right?
“so you think living is just an everlasting chain of continuing life? Nothing else?”
Well not my life or yours, but the existence of mankind in general.
“Are you thinking about ancient mythology, because that word comes from the root word MYTH. Only one God out here!”
It wasn’t called mythology back when those religions were in practice. You can be sure that islam, christianity, and all the current religions will fall under that category.
“irishthunder, what do you believe in? are you athiest or something? if yes, then what are you doing on this website, sounds to me like you are unsure of yourself.”
You should look around this site a little more, try clicking the “About” link up top. Most everyone here doesn’t believe in yours or any god.
January 10th, 2008 at 5:54 pm
irishthunder:
“Why does there need to be something after?”
Because, every before has an after.
“make society and our species better.I honestly can’t think of how thats a bad thing.”
Don’t get me wrong, that isn’t a bad thing, that is what we should do, but the concept of your purpose is wrong.
“purpose of life is to continue life”, so you think living is just an everlasting chain of continuing life? Nothing else?
WELL, I GUESS YOU HAVE A PURPOSE AND I HAVE A PURPOSE… were going on paralell roads here, and we will never reach at an intersection…I sence your stuburn and you will never take someone elses word. (my opinion)
“one of the THOUSANDS of gods out there” How can I explain this to you, THERE IS ONLY ONE GOD! Are you thinking about ancient mythology, because that word comes from the root word MYTH. Only one God out here!
irishthunder, what do you believe in? are you athiest or something? if yes, then what are you doing on this website, sounds to me like you are unsure of yourself.
January 10th, 2008 at 5:17 pm
Why does there need to be something after? Why by afraid of death?
“Why should we make life better than the way we found it?”
You misread, I said make society and our species better. I honestly can’t think of how thats a bad thing.
“do you believe life has NO purpose”
I definitely just explained the purpose of life. Let me simplify it even more for you, the purpose of life is to continue life. Just because im not falling on my knees and praising one of the THOUSANDS of gods out there doesn’t mean im a nihilist.
January 10th, 2008 at 4:29 pm
“We are here to survive, to live, and to do whatever we can to make our society and our species better than the way you found it.”
And after that….then what? Why should we make life better than the way we found it?…because life HAS a purpose.
Correct me if I am wrong,
do you believe life has NO purpose (because YOU sure sound like that)
January 10th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
“Did you ever think that there must be a reason for us living on earth?”
The sad thing is a lot of people think that way. Why do you feel the need for a higher power to tell you what to do? Is it possible that our species may have the same purpose as all the other species on this planet(along with the rest of the universe)? We are here to survive, to live, and to do whatever we can to make our society and our species better than the way you found it.
January 10th, 2008 at 3:24 pm
Hello,
hyrocket:”you write good english”
…Thank you
Biba is my nickname, my friends call me Biba.
I am a Muslim, and I speak two languages (English and Arabic.)
January 10th, 2008 at 3:23 pm
Irishthunder:”The best thing about living a life in reality and fact is that there is absolutely no need to have faith in what any religion tells you.”
I disagree with you. I believe the best thing about living life is that we have faith.
If you have no faith or belief, then what is the point of life?
Did you ever think that there must be a reason for us living on earth?
Life has a purpose, and having Faith falls with that purpose.
January 10th, 2008 at 12:58 am
Biba, what does biba mean? or is it your name? you write good english, are you a muslim and speak muslim?
January 9th, 2008 at 9:05 pm
The best thing about living a life in reality and fact is that there is absolutely no need to have faith in what any religion tells you.
January 9th, 2008 at 8:49 pm
Hi
I beleive there is NO god but Allah. There is only ONE God!
And I am 100% sure that the Quran has NOT been changed through the centuries. It is the “most precise” because of that.
How can I prove that the Quran has not been changed… well i trust the Islamic scientists who live for religion, and know a whole lot more than me and you.
From my point of view, (if you can read and fully understand the Holy Quran,) you will see how beautiful Quran is, and the Quran unravles the beauty/mystery of life, and the here-after.
people just have to believe.(and i understand some are ignorant and dont)
January 9th, 2008 at 7:27 pm
So you think that there is ABSOLUTELY no chance that someone besides your god wrote it? And there is no way for you to know that it hasn’t been altered in different ways throughout the centuries. HOW exactly is it the “most precise” holy book out there?
And let us not forget that there are MANY other gods out there, have you heard the word of mighty Thor? what about all-powerful Ra?
January 9th, 2008 at 7:20 pm
correction, the bible has so maney different versions!
January 9th, 2008 at 7:19 pm
Yes, irishthunder, I do know who’s words are in the Quran, they are Allah(swt)-Gods words. They were sent down to Prophit Mohamad(pba)by angel Gabrael. And the Quran has been the same (not a word or letter has changed) since a long time ago. The Quran is the most precise Holy book. How can you read the Quran and say it is crappy knowing that this is the real “thing”…its NOT crappy!, and
unlike the bible, there are like a milion different versions!
January 9th, 2008 at 7:07 pm
biba, do you know who wrote the Quran? when it was written? But it is my opinion about it being crappy, i read it, along with the bible, and both are horribly written.
January 9th, 2008 at 7:02 pm
“crappy book of sketchy origins.”
irishthunder…is that an opinion? Back yourself up!
January 9th, 2008 at 7:00 pm
don’t worry about it biba, i think he’s just trying to turn you into a vampire, or a cannibal, i always mix those up.
January 9th, 2008 at 6:59 pm
“crappy book of sketchy origins.”
irishthunder….what book are you talking about?
January 9th, 2008 at 6:58 pm
“Do you know the power of the blood in Christ Jesus? He can give you life and through him you are saved.”
hyrocket….WHAT IS THAT SUPPOSED TO MEAN?????
January 9th, 2008 at 6:57 pm
“Our beliefs have a basis”
The problem is your beliefs have no basis in facts or reality, your basis is from a crappy book of sketchy origins.
January 9th, 2008 at 6:55 pm
BY THE WAY, SHIA GIRL IS BIBA.
January 9th, 2008 at 6:53 pm
i dont know…you guys are too “debative”.
Our beliefs have a basis.
Some shias go overboard just like in the pictures above. I for one am against the activities in the pictures, and i am shia. I say this because shias dont have to do this, and even so, shouldnt do this. Some shia parties just do. Take Christianity for example. Some chritian parties re-enact the crusifying of Jesus by having themselves nailed to a cross. This is painful aswell as the shias in the above pictures. I HAVE NO FURTHER COMMENTS.
As for the “respect” thing, i can’t make you respect something you set your mind against. I just think respect is the human thing to do, and despite your negative/positive feelings, one should always respect others.
and As for the “invisible pink unicorn” written by Alcari, that was very funny, hahaha. (sarcastically speaking!)
January 9th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
“think about it Shia.”
If all religious people did that we wouldn’t need sites like this.
January 9th, 2008 at 6:44 pm
shia girl, what is the heart of the issue here?
“flagellating themselves with chains or cutting their foreheads until blood streams from their bodies”.
Do you know the power of the blood in Christ Jesus? He can give you life and through him you are saved.
think about it Shia.
January 9th, 2008 at 4:20 pm
The question has nothing to do with research, or with what particular religion you follow.
The question was why we should respect you beliefs, and the ‘rights’ you asume to claim from them, even though your beliefs have no basis at all.
I respect your religion in the same way you respect Pastafarians and believers in the Invisible Pink Unicorn, which is to say, not at all.
Probably even less, because the churches of the FSM and IPU don’t force their beliefs on anyone and have never hurt anyone from the basis of their religion.
So, the question again:
Why should we respect your religion?
January 9th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
hyrocket: “Hello Shia girl, can i ask you something?”
what do you want to ask???
January 9th, 2008 at 4:04 pm
sidfaiu, honestly, i dont understand what you want me to prove….you want me to explain why you should respect “my” religion? I think you should go and do some real research (and not just online, go find a real book about islam-shia.)
January 8th, 2008 at 6:14 pm
Hello Shia girl, can i ask you something?
January 8th, 2008 at 4:08 pm
Hello shia girl,
Stupid? no. Irrational? in many ways, yes. Why should I respect irrational and unfounded beliefs? I’ve yet to hear a good reason. Perhaps you’ll be the one to finally provide one.
January 8th, 2008 at 3:44 pm
I am shia and i believe in my religion.
Those pictures above are very disturbing, shias around my society, and shias i know would never do this- but these people have a purpose.
idk, however In our religion, we should never hurt ourselfs to death. The people in the pictures probably want to feel the pain, and put themselves in imam Husayn’s shoes. But this isn’t a must…people who actually know the story of ashura might feel the same way.
oh well………my religion is NOT stupid! and i think you SHOULD recpect EVERY religion thats followers are submited to God!
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:25 pm
Muslim Sheii Person:
“I would like to make something clear to all of you people involved in this conversation that some of you called us and our believes “STUPID†so what do you think about the people who worship the cows or the ones who worship mice and eat it’s pooop or the people who nail them selves to crosses.â€
You completely missed the point. None of these examples you mentioned do any harm to other people or animals except themself - unlike the smiling mother on this page who wields a large knife next to her baby who bleed from cuts to the head.
It’s really a question of ethics here – not intelligense.
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:14 pm
Muslim Sheii Person:
“so think about what you write before writing it! By the way you’re invited to our cerimony in Muharam !!!â€
What is it I missed thinking about? Otherwise I aggree with your post except of course the part where you say no one can live without a belief.
Thanks for the invitation though. Shall I bring my own beer?
January 2nd, 2008 at 10:55 am
Demanding respect of a concept like religion is very annoying to me as generally the people demanding respect of their religion have no respect of other concepts just because of their religion.
To me, demanding respect of religion is on the same group where demands for respect of nazism, fascism, apartheid etc. reside.
Why would people have to respect concepts which seldom are able to incite respect on their own and rely on the adherents fanaticism and evangelizing on its expansion?
I can respect people but demanding respect to a concept erodes that respect I had prior such demands.
Some concepts like liberty, equality and such that I can respect them even if no one would utter a word in their defense.
January 2nd, 2008 at 9:20 am
So do I! That’s why I respect almost no religions at all.
January 2nd, 2008 at 6:10 am
I respect every religion that consists of only purity and no evil whatsoever, I do not respect this.
January 2nd, 2008 at 6:02 am
how discusting, those poor children. what has this world come to? God and Allah is angry at all of you disrespectful, evil muslims. Allah doesnt teach this and if he does then HE is the devil. It is dangerous when untaught people are following an evil religion. Please change your evil deeds now or else God will not forgive.
January 1st, 2008 at 6:11 pm
Hellow again
I’m writing this to you Corso :
I think that no one can live without a believe everyone is raised up as their parents believes. And from all around the world i can see people teaching thier children to do certain things in religion. And the most common thing is parents taking thier child to church every Sunday even if they don’t want to. If your parents were christian they would never teach you jewish or islam. so i just would like you to know that without your parents you wouldn’t be talking about whose believe is write or wrong.Your parents didn’t wait for you to turn 18 to give their believe “just lika car lisence” so think about what you write before writing it! By the way you’re invited to our cerimony in Muharam !!!
January 1st, 2008 at 4:54 pm
Hi!
I am a Sheii person my religion taught me to respect all religions and I would like to make something clear to all of you people involved in this conversation that some of you called us and our believes “STUPID” so what do you think about the people who worship the cows or the ones who worship mice and eat it’s pooop or the people who nail them selves to crosses. I’m not saying they are stupid. I’m saying why is it you, only think we are the stupid ones. So my whole point of writing this is that, I’m proud to be a sheii… THANK YOU !!
December 26th, 2007 at 7:26 pm
Ayesha:
“Think of it, These people are willing to DIE for something they believe in so strongly..How is that not beautiful…Even the children”
I want to ask you. In your mind how old is a child before it is old enough to decide whether it want to die for Islam or not?
What happens if a child says “I do not want to die for Islam” or “I do not want to be a muslim” or “MOM NO PLEASE DONT HURT ME MOOM!”?
“if my family are freaks, then what does that make you?…..”
Normal and caring.
I have to tell you Ayesha you and your family deserves prison for hurting defenceless children. Shame on you.
Corso
December 26th, 2007 at 5:09 pm
muslim, a lot of stupid people do a lot of stupid things in the name of religion, deal with it dumbass.
December 26th, 2007 at 2:07 pm
in the name of allah, the merciful, the compasionate
there is no need for this to take place, especially since its making the shias look bad and i honestly doubt this is the message hussain (as) wanted to put across. hussain’s sacrifice was meant to preserve the ‘true’ islam at the time of muhammed (pbuh) before people became hypocrites and tried to chNGE THE RELIGION EG. YAZID, MUAWIA ETC…
surely allah is the best of judges…
November 15th, 2007 at 10:29 am
shiaa krriiiiiizzzzzyyyyyyy
October 12th, 2007 at 5:06 pm
ok, i am a muslim, but, really, what the hell!!!!
October 12th, 2007 at 2:20 pm
In Iraq, where do Shia go to mourn Ashura? In 2004 wasn’t there some unfortunate problems such as bombings and drownings from a stampede across a bridge? From what I have read, this is a day that Saddam did not allow the Shia to mourn/celebrate/act out their religious rites. In 2008, how will Iraqi Shia go about this important day in their religion?
October 12th, 2007 at 9:12 am
Hi to all
my name is mehdi.im from IRAN.and im a SHIA.i saw this pictures about shia in this site.im not refuse it.but i wana to you know it is not the SHIA culture.but you know that the stupid people are in all over the world.and if you know ayat ollah khamenayi (the irans emam).he has said that it is something wronge.and no one shouldnt do this.and in iran who do that arests by police.shia is some thing diffrent but the goverments that thay dont like to the other nation know about islam and shia trys to sho this stupid peoples. so i give you my invation to come to iran in next MOHARAM.we have some wonderful programes here.
October 11th, 2007 at 4:50 am
beauty of this??!!? soryy cant see the beauty anywhere… all i can see is blood… loads and loads of blood… and bleeding kids…. oh my days!!!! if u knew islam really,, READ QURAN if u call urself a muslim!!! Allah SWT said HIMSELF!!! do not tempt to hurt urself as this body does not belong to you!!! it is a property of our God that has been lended to you for this life time so that you could prove urself worthy of the beauty of Janna (paradise)!!! and when u die! thats when Allah SWT will take the body back!!!! how can u say this is beautiful? how can u call this ISLAM??? when it goes against not only the morality of human nature but also THE ISLAM!!!!???? i dnot have anything against other beliefs and faiths… u can believe in COWS for all i care….. but THIS???? THIS IS NOT ISLAM!! i cant seem to understand where you got this from!?!?!? do u think that even ALI (May PEace and blessing be uppon him)would accept something like that??!?!?!!? this is inhuman.. hurting urselves like this/?? even his sons H & H wouldnt accept this… who told ut his is what they really wanted??? THEY were muslims!!!!! THEY would never allow this!!! URGHH>>>….
October 2nd, 2007 at 7:50 pm
why is this site called “religiousfreaks”. it is wrong. you people must be so uneducated really, can you not see the beauty of this. its a practice done by shia muslims all over the world, even me, my father and mother, brothers sisters cousins etc etc, so if my family are freaks, then what does that make you?….. Think of it, These people are willing to DIE for something they believe in so strongly..How is that not beautiful…Even the children
Regards Ayesha
July 30th, 2007 at 5:30 am
[...] 3 Things I do not understand: Quantum physics, Chinese script, Ashura [...]
July 28th, 2007 at 10:10 pm
Nope,sorry
July 10th, 2007 at 5:42 pm
If things continue this way, sid, you may yet have to be. Gas, where is you?
July 10th, 2007 at 4:28 pm
Nope, sorry.
July 10th, 2007 at 4:14 pm
yo sid, are u the guy in charge of this website?
July 10th, 2007 at 1:12 pm
im sorry for posting that 3 times, it was an accident lol
July 10th, 2007 at 9:51 am
may allah bless u brother…
i just wanted to see your point of veiw thats all, were all brothers in faith and society and must respect each other,
about the hating of the companions, thats wrong we consider them great companions of the prophet, but after they userped ali\’s right thats the point where they were seen as hypocrites if u understand what im sayin bro…
any ways thanks for your help inshala you will be successfull brother
July 10th, 2007 at 9:50 am
may allah bless u brother…
i just wanted to see your point of veiw thats all, were all brothers in faith and society and must respect each other,
about the hating of the companions, thats wrong we consider them great companions of the prophet, but after they userped ali\’s right thats the point where they were seen as hypocrites if u understand what im sayin bro…
any wayz thanks for your help inshala you will be successfull brother…
July 10th, 2007 at 9:49 am
may allah bless u brother…
i just wanted to see your point of veiw thats all, were all brothers in faith and society and must respect each other,
about the hating of the companions, thats wrong we consider them great companions of the prophet, but after they userped ali\’s right thats the point where they were seen as hypocrites if u understand what im sayin bro…
any wayz thanks for your help inshala you will be successfull bro…
July 9th, 2007 at 6:29 pm
Muslim,
I never heard about Shia till I came here to USA, when I was in Egypt I didn’t even hear about Shia or Sunnis, I didn’t know that I’m labeled as Sunni.
The fuuny thing that I used to wrok in Hotel, and I had some Iraqi friends and I knew that they are Shiaa and I didn’t know what the difference at this time, and accidently I was talking about how good Abu Baker is and Omar Bin Elkhatab and even Ali, but I didn’t know that Shii don’t like The prophet companions, so every time I think about it, I feel bad, they might think that I intentionly doing it, but honestly I didn’t.
I discussed the topic before, and as you see even when I talk with non-muslim, I tend to use logic more than Quran, and the same here you have to look at the logic, as you know that it’s destined who is going to be the king or the Claip or the president, and you can go back to the Quran in that, so the fact that Gos destinted Abu baker and the other to be before Ali was detinted, and there are a lot of evidence that it was the right sequence to happen, and Ali as you know was so brave, and you should know better than me, if you read about Ali which I’m sure you did, he is the one of the most admirable companinon even for Sunni, and as you know without Ali as the other companion, there wouldn’t be religion called Islam, so we don’t hate Ali, on the contrary we like him, and you can listen about Ali story from Sunni prospective from “Amr Khaled” and I can give you the link for his story .
I don’t consider Shii is Kafer, I can’t claim any thing like that, you said La Allah Alla Allah and Muhammed Rasul Allah, so God will judge you for what you believe not me.
I’m nothing to judge anybody.
For why the terrorist attack Shiia, you have to ask them, not me I really don’t know why is it happening, it might be for the power or the money(oil), or may be feeling that Shii was one of the reasons that USA in Iraq, that’s all I could think about the issue, you might have different thought.
July 9th, 2007 at 3:11 pm
in the name of allah the compasionate, the merciful
to begin with i would like to say that this debate is very interesting and well done mohammed for coping the whole way, mashala may allah bless you…
mohammed i hope you wouldnt mind if i ask you a few questions….
1) as you know the ‘aqeedah’ of the sunnis and shiasn slighlty differs, we have the same basic beliefs but there are slight differeneces, with all due respect, what are the sunni reasons for ubu bakr to have the calipha?
2) why do the sunnis regard ali as the fourth caliph and consider the event of ghadir khum (even though they accept it took place) voisd, even with the prophet making it clear?
3) why are there terrorists out there who hate us shias and say we are kufar, is that just?
my dear brother mohammed, you seem to be a great person who is out there defending islam (hopefully in a non violent way), inshala you are a true mu’min and may allah bless you.
July 8th, 2007 at 4:07 am
Any time Sid.
July 7th, 2007 at 5:41 pm
Thanks Mohamed,
When I do start learning about the Qur’an, I hope I can chat with you about it. I’m interested in a scholarly approach to the book but I’d also like the thoughts of a believer, especially a reasonable one like yourself.
July 7th, 2007 at 1:56 pm
Quran in one Arabic, it doesn’t change to a differnet accent, we study classic Arabic for 12 years, so we understand classic Arabic, but here is the difference, this guy took two hours to explain “thank God”, he explained it from every aspect, the other thing you have to notice that there are a lot of Sheiks liten to him too, so if he makes one mistake, believe me you will find every body talking about it in ME.
The other thing I would like to mention, I heard a lot of sheikhs try to intrpret Quran, and it was like what the mircale in what they saying, but when this guy explained it, it was something different, you start to realease why the Quran is mircale.
July 7th, 2007 at 12:22 pm
Mohammed, did you read Quran in the Classical Arabic or in Egyptian Arabic?
If you do not know Classical Arabic, then how are we able to trust anything you say as you cannot truly understand what Quran says?
Also, if “… because new meanings show every time…” how one can trust anyone who is fluent in Classical Arabic in the first place?
July 7th, 2007 at 10:20 am
Sid,
Correction, I meant that all their life knew Muhammed, and he never said a poets, sorry I mad a lot of mistakes.
July 7th, 2007 at 9:51 am
Sid,
Prophry Muhammed was raised in the Arabic area, and they were really good at saying poetry, and they were the best to do so, and they have a lot of contest to see who the best person to use the language to say poems, and it was source of pride, Quran came in Arabic for those people to challange them, so God came with lnaguage make them think. The know Muhammed all their life, they know that he was a poet, so where did he come with these words.
Regarding my third point, Ayah is verse of Quran(that’s what I meant), God challange for the human being, to write one verse of Quran like the Quran, nobody could till now, there were a lot of tries but nobody could.
God said he will protect Quran from changing, did you hear that Quran changed from 1400 years, so he is right that it’s from him, because when God protect Quran, nobody will be able to change it, and that’s why at one point, all the people who memorize Quran will die, and the Quran will life to the sky(prophcy), so God keeps it from changing, and that will be one the big signs of the judgment day.
How could I know if this guy was saying the truth, the guy said in alot of times, that his interpration is not expalaining, because you can’t explain Quran, if somebody would explain Quran that would be prophet Muhammed, but he didn’t, because Quran for all ages, unlike other books as bible and Torah.
Again, I’m not here to convince somebody, I’m here to make you think about it, you are the one who can do the search and read, and know better. I’m not going to change somebody’s mind, as you see there are a lot of people hates Muslims, and it’s ok, I understand that, there a lot fo Muslims nobody hear about, it’s all about the extremist, that’s all what they hear.
I hope you make sure you pick the right source of reading about Quran, I wish I could help you with that, but I would rather you to choose your own source.
July 7th, 2007 at 8:50 am
Hello Mohamed,
“he analyse every word and why it came here, and what if he God choosed another word.”
Really it’s the same difference. Why are you certain that his analysis/interpretation is correct? Seriously, this guy presumes to know exactly why God choose each word of the Qur’an. How is it that he knows God’s mind? You are simply believing based on authority.
Also, why would God not write the Qur’an so that anybody, including non-Arabic speakers, including your 11-year-old-self, could understand exactly what He meant? He is all powerful, after all. Claiming that the Qur’an must remain in Arabic to be understood correctly smacks of cultural arrogance to me (not that the US lacks any arrogance, but that is a different topic).
“God left the Bible and Torah for people to protect, but people changed them to what serve their interest, not what God told them, so God promised that he is going to keep the Quran from any body to change a wrod or even a letter in Quran”
I don’t care that other cultures copy books imperfectly (I agree, by the way, that those books were changed for personal agendas). Anal retentive copying doesn’t imply truth. And where does God promise that he is going to keep the Qur’an pure? In the Qur’an? That would be circular reasoning.
I’m sorry to say that I still don’t quite understand your third reason. No miracles like those described in the Qur’an have been demonstrated elsewhere? Is that right? I haven’t seen it demonstrated that any miracles described in the Qur’an did occur.
In short, while these may be good enough reasons for you to believe, they are extremely far from convincing me. But, as I’ve said before, I know very little about the Qur’an. I want to learn more, but would prefer a non-bias source. That may be very difficult to find. Does the community have any suggestions?
July 6th, 2007 at 11:39 pm
Sid,
He didn’t explain it to my satisfaction, I was young and when I read Quran, I can’t get the meaning out of it, and I was reading the Quran as a story, but when I heard him interpreting the Quran, that was really different experience, I don’t know how to explain it, he analyse every word and why it came here, and what if he God choosed another word.
God left the Bible and Torah for people to protect, but people changed them to what serve their interest, not what God told them, so God promised that he is going to keep the Quran from any body to change a wrod or even a letter in Quran, and that what is happening right now, 1400 years and Quran is the same, one copy not 700000 bible.
Ayah is like Boris said exactly, but I will make it closer in meaning to you, it means verse too.
July 6th, 2007 at 8:01 pm
ayah seems to mean sign or miracle. so let’s substitute
“3- God challanged people that they will not be able to get one SIGN/MIRACLE like what’s in Quran, and nobody was up to the challange yet, you can see people tried on the internt, but when you look at it, it’s BS, if you change one word in what they wrote, you already came up with better meaning, and some people think that Quran about rhyme, which is stupid, alot of verse in Quran has no Rhyme and yet it still sound good to your ears.”
i still can’t really make sense of it.
mohamed, you did answer the question. but i do have to say that between a childhood story, a dubious (and circular claim) about consistency, and a third reason i honestly can’t understand, it’s really not very convincing.
July 6th, 2007 at 7:12 pm
Hey Mohamed,
So you believe the Qur’an because 1, you found someone who interpreted the verses to your satisfaction, 2, it didn’t change, and 3, something about ‘Ayah’ that I don’t understand.
I think the point Andrew has been trying to make is that there are so many ways to interpret the Qur’an that eventually anyone can find an interpretation that suites them. What are we to do when interpretations contradict one another? If I’m not mistaken, people are killing each other over different interpretations. So the question becomes, why are you certain that your interpretation is the correct one?
Just because a culture is good at carefully copying a book doesn’t make the book true. If you are relying on the claim that “Allah said it would not change”, then you are using circular reasoning since he ’said’ that in the Qur’an.
Please explain reason 3 to me; I truly don’t understand.
Thanks
July 6th, 2007 at 12:47 pm
bismillah al rahman al-rahim,
it is true, the truth will win,
atm mohammed and me (mostly mohammed), seem to hav the upper hand.
July 5th, 2007 at 9:19 pm
Boris,
I will tell you something, and I’m going tell you the truth about why I believe it’s the truth.
When I was young my dad used to watch some guy called Elsheikh Elsha3rawy, at this time I was like 11 years old, I wasn’t really into Islam, and this guy was explaining Quran, I red Quran and I memorized Quran, but it didn’t make any affect in me, when I listened to this guy and they way he explained the Quran, it was different for me, he interpret it in way nobody does before, and it really makes sense to me, by the way nobody can explain the Quran, because new meanings show every time, and that’s why the Sheikh Elsha3arawy said I can’t expalin it.
This guy shows why God choosed certain words, and he was say that the people attack Islam should choosen this word instead of this word, he asnwer why god choose this word, it was really amzing how perfect this book is.
It took this guy almost 30 years to interpret the Quran, and he did it and he died( God mercy him), since then I was intersted and I knew there is no way this Book is from human being, add to that this guy wasn’t like the other sheikhs that shout and raise his voice to prove his point, on the contrary he was really calm and easy to listen to.
2- Quran didn’t change since its written, and that’s was God promise.
3- God challanged people that they will not be able to get one Ayah like what’s in Quran, and nobody was up to the challange yet, you can see people tried on the internt, but when you look at it, it’s BS, if you change one word in what they wrote, you already came up with better meaning, and some people think that Quran about rhyme, which is stupid, alot of verse in Quran has no Rhyme and yet it still sound good to your ears.
I hope that answered your question, I know you will come up with a new questions, but it’s ok.
July 5th, 2007 at 8:17 pm
“Truth = Quran”
ok, mohamed. i do get that you believe that. give me top 3 reasons (in your opinion) why quran indeed is the truth. if you can, i would like to avoid circular ones like “quran is truth because quran says so”.
July 5th, 2007 at 7:02 pm
Boris,
For me the whole issue in not about winning debate, I’m not going to take the award fo winning the debate, it’s more to show no matter how you attack or misinform people about Islam because they don’t know, I’m here to figure out the truth and answer you back.
Truth = Quran.
July 5th, 2007 at 3:24 pm
sid found out by a miracle of god, how else? he also could have found out by looking at the IP logs, but a miracle is much more likely. muslim, what you did IS deceit. as you said, you tried to strengthen your side of the debate through less than honest means. i am not exactly surprised, i must say.