RULES: Please ask questions related to Deism and refrain from making comments until I post Brian’s answers. –gasmonso
My name is Brian Jones, better known here by my posting name of Humanistic Jones. I am a deist from Marietta, Georgia. I was born into a Roman Catholic family and thought that I followed the tenants of the religion pretty well. Around the age of 16, I came to a realization, that I didn’t. I had managed to personally resolve that evolution was possible, that the universe was billions of years old, and that the bible was a great moral work. When my personal belief became known however, I was told to choose… the literal bible, or science. Can you guess what I chose?
Deism as a movement is not very prevalent. The major tenant of Deism is that there is a god, but that there is no Revelation of universal truth. Most deists also fall under a humanistic bent, felling that more than religious development, the development of human society should be the main focus. This is all pretty simplified and I’ll expound a bit further down.
I encourage any questions that you may have, from all sides of the fence. I will do my best to answer them with politeness and accuracy. I know I will probably get questions from the religious believers amongst the readers (and I’m looking forward to those, I love discussion), I am also looking forward to questions from the other naturalist and humanists amongst you. Have fun, go to town, and I’ll be back with the answers in due time.
Peace to all,
Brian "Humanistic" Jones
Being a naturalistic religion, many ends of Deism are open to the personal interpretation of the believer. Most Deists come from Theistic practices, finding that though the existence of god is logical, the "Revealed Truths" of organized religions are not. A surprising duality exists in the fact that while a Deist would argue vehemently against Religion being made a public institution (such as becoming a part of the common law or being taught in schools) we also feel called to stand up for any injustice committed against a religion simply because of their beliefs. To quote Voltaire, one of our movement’s greatest minds, "I disagree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it!"
There are a few different flavors of Deism, the two broadest categories being Critical Deists and Constructive Deists. Critical Deism is the rejection of revealed religion where Constructive Deism is the belief that Reason leads us to some basic religious truths.
To expound on these (taken from www.moderndeism.com)
Critical deism’s rejection of revealed religion might include some or all of the following:
-Rejection of all religions based on books that claim to contain the revealed word of God.
-Rejection of the claim that the Bible is the revealed word of God.
-Rejection of reports of miracles and prophecies.
-Rejection of religious "mysteries" such as the doctrines of transubstantiation, the Trinity, the Incarnation, etc.
-Rejection of only the parts of the Bible that contain miracles, prophecies, or mysteries.
-Rejection of Christianity.
Some Deists rejected miracles and prophecies but still considered themselves to be Christians — because they believed in what they felt to be the pure, original form of Christianity, i.e. Christianity as it existed before it was corrupted by additions of such superstitions as miracles, prophecies, and the doctrine of the Trinity. Some Deists rejected the claim of Jesus’s divinity, but continued to hold him in high regard as a moral teacher (see, for example, Thomas Jefferson’s famous Jefferson Bible). Other, more radical, Deists rejected Christianity altogether, and expressed hostility toward Christianity which they regarded as pure superstition. In return, Christian writers often charged radical Deists with atheism.
Constructive deism held some or all of the following beliefs:
-God exists and created the universe.
-God wants human beings to behave morally.
-Human beings have souls that survive death, i.e. there is an afterlife.
-In the afterlife, God will reward moral behavior and punish immoral behavior.
No related posts.

You indicate that you believe in both evolution and that we have a soul/afterlife. Would you agree that this means that all living creatures therefore have a soul? Can you detail your beliefs regarding the morality of killing (man or animal) with respect to the above point, and where exactly the cutoff point is (if any?)
Cheers
Dave
Hello Humanistic Jones!
It’s nice to know that there is a fellow Deist in the Bible Belt (I live in Charlotte, NC). I have been looking forward to discussing this topic with you. I am very new to Deism and have many, many questions. I was raised as a Southern-Baptist evangelical and, like you, began seeing discrepancies between what I was being told and reason. This lead to a rejection of Christianity at the age of about 19 and a deep-seeded resentment for evangelicals and fundamentalist who have lied to me all my life and caused me to behave immorally.
Since the entire foundation of my belief system had been rejected, I underwent a desperate search for truth. I learned all I could about all the major world religions but I simply could not accept the supernatural aspects of religion. Finally I found philosophy. After years of studying philosophy in college, I began forming a set of beliefs.
I discovered Deism through research I did for a posting on this site and was shocked to find that Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Paine, Benjamin Franklin, and many others had pretty much the same beliefs as I had formed in college. In hindsight this should not have surprised me since they read the same philosophers that I had. Since then, I have been trying to learn more about Deism. Unfortunately, it has not been easy since Deism doesn’t seem like much of an organized religion.
Finally, here are some of my questions:
1. How can I meet more Deists?
2. In reading about Deism, I discovered that many Deists seem to use Intelligent Design as proof of God’s existence. I reject this as I see evidence of spontaneous complexity in nature. I instead accept the logical validity of Leibniz’s version cosmological argument. What is your rational basis for believing in God?
I leave it at just two questions for now. Thanks for volunteering to explain your beliefs. I am looking forward to your answers.
SidFaiwu
If you believe in souls, when do you believe that come into existence or become attached to the human meatsack (depending on your belief, if any)? Would it be at conception? Do you believe abortion of a lifeless clump of cells is murder? How about the morning after pill?
Do you know just how big the Deist movement is nowadays? I checked the wiki entry, which says that it’s growing explosively (as a percentage, so take it as you will), but just how easy is it to find Deists these days?
Seems to me most people are Deists without knowing it.
Look:
Tons of people interpreting their own religion to better frame their own internal code of conduct. Like for example, Dr. Laura; she uses the old testament against homosexuality, but she’s not pro-slave or animal sacrifice. She does not follow her religion, she follows herself and THEN finds a religion more or les consistent with her own conclusions.
What did she find (like so many others)? Deism! Belives in god and THEN add something of this and something of that; maybe Jesus, maybe some parts or interpretations of the bible.
Yé!
There you are. My mother was catholic. Non-praticant. Belived that god would acept any good person no matter the religion he practiced in life. did not much care for Jesus. Worked on sundays. But did not eat sweets during the ‘Carème’ (40 days before resurection or such?).
Actually, she only called herself catholic, she was really just Deist… Like most people…
It’s easy to find Deist people to talk to: find the organized religion which upholds the same values as you and then find the least bible-thumping of the lot.
Easy. Or move to Quebec… hehehe… atheist floods here tho…
I’m curious about this particular statement, “…original form of Christianity, i.e. Christianity as it existed before it was corrupted by additions of such superstitions as miracles, prophecies, and the doctrine of the Trinity.” Explain this, please.
Thanks for taking questions, HJ I’ve read many of your posts and find you to be very reasonable.
Three questions, and really they could be for any belief
First, do deists believe god takes an active role in human affairs?
Second, assuming a yes answer to the first question, why would an omnipotent being care about a lifeform so far below it?
Three, do deists base their beliefs on evidence or a lack thereof? How amenable are they to scientific facts?
Obviously, you can’t speak for all deists, I’m simply wondering if there are some general beliefs beyond saying god exists.
Thanks for your time.
Shouldn’t deists, by definition, be independant from each other and have only in common the ‘There is something else.’? (be it a creator-god, caring-god, absent-god, alien-creator, etc.)
First off, let me start by saying the Deism is probably the most contructive religion as far as improving society goes. And add that the ever-prevalent “churchism” is non-existant. If I didn’t think god is a figment of imagination, I’d be a deists :P
Now to stop sucking up and start asking…
Question 1:
How do you judge which parts of the bible to add to your religion? How do you define what god thinks is “morally right”? seeing how morals vary between nations do you believe that god chooses those that follow the local moral best, or those that follow some all-applicable morals?
Question 2:
What is your opinion on Evolution and the Big Bang? How does god fit into this view of the world?
I have question and I hope you answer that, Jesus said that his miracle would be like Jonah. like Jonah was buried in the stomach of the whale for three days, Jesus will burried in the earth for three days, and Jesus said he will be like Jonah, and it’s know that Jonah didn’t die, so how do you think Jesus curcified(which mean dead) and he said I will be like Jonah.
The other thing, that Jesus as you claim curcified on Friday and then Marry went on Sunday, and she didn’t find him in his grave, which with counting it’s not three days.
Do you still Jesus curcified???????????????
“tenants of the religion … tenants of Deism” – why should we take anything you say seriously when you are too stupid to know the difference between “tenets” and “tenants”? Idiot.
Sorry for my earlier comment. That was uncalled for and really rude of me. You’re not an idiot, and I apologize.
I was just about to jump all over you for being a total ass Geoff, but your apology is acceptable ;) If you want to volunteer to answer questions from the readers, then please contact me, otherwise don’t interrupt the rest of us with insults. Save that for the regular threads :)
gasmonso
Hi,
i live in alabama,bible belt central, i hate this shit hole but more importantly my question, im agnostic but barely i think a god is possible in theory(same as bigfoot) but if asked id pretty much say no, whats the biggest diff between agnostic and Deism?
With Deists, there IS a God.
With agnostics, there COULD be a God, who knows?
I’d say that anything is possible in theory.
” Do you believe abortion of a lifeless clump of cells is murder?”
If they are a clump of cells they are by definition alive.
Regarding Deism, if I missed this then apologies, which school do you fall into? And out of curiosity if you reject all forms of organized religion why do you believe in a deity at all? The idea that “I believe in God but know nothing about him/her/it” seems odd to me.
I’m glad you chose to do this, Humanistic. I’m surprised at the amount of misunderstanding there is around Deism.
Just one or two questions for the Christians, Jews and Moslems who believe in the words in Genesis.
1. How could Eve have sined if she was without the knowledge of good and evil (knowing right from wrong) when she bit into the fruit giving her her conscience, her ability to know right from wrong?
2. Why did adam and eve respond to God by hiding so He would not notice they were nude? One would think that the first thing they would feel bad about was disobeying Him, not being nude. What a auspicious beginning to our feelings about our bodies eh!
3. What was God so afraid of? He orders the cherub to guard the “Tree of Life” so as not to allow adam or eve to eat from that tree lest they live forever like Him. If adam and eve had a brain, they would have figured out that they could have eaten from that three first, then run over the the forbidden tree and eaten that. At that point, God could not have killed them. HMMM! I smell a set-up. Eve and Adam are innocent as is the serpent who actually never lied to them, but God did lie when he said they would die that very day if they ate from the forbidden tree. It appears they lived many hundred more years though. Lucem Ferre LeVan
Sooo, when do the answers come in?
I do not want to rush you, if you have your reasons for not having them up, that’s fine by me, was just wondering when they discussion starts.
I’m quite curious about the answers
I compiled the complete list of questions for Brian this morning and handed them off. Once I receive word from him, I’ll pass that information on to you guys :)
gasmonso
Yargle Blargle, through travel and technical issues being handled with my job, I finally go those questions answered, should be up soon! Sorry for the Delay!
Alas it is true!!! Humanistic Jones has come back from the dead to answer the questions. It’ll take me a little bit to get them on the site, but they will be.
It’s a good thing to because it buys me more time to finish answering mine :)
Thanks Brian!!!
gasmonso
Welcome back, Humanistic!
Hi My name is Jasmine Scott and I have a few questions.Well first let me tell you that I’m aq christian and go to Calvary Chapel in Hanford.Now, to my qhestion,
What king of Babylon conquered Judah and carried the people into exile????????????
When do you right back?
Lol, take your time its a hard question!!!!!
doesnt the bible say it was Nebuchadnezzar?
did i get it right jasmine?
Nebuchadnezzar II or Nabû-kudurri-uṣur as he is also known. This is according to both actual Babylonian historical recordings and the Biblical Book of Daniel, however, a few of the claims put on Nebuchadnezzar in Daniel are unconfirmed and are considered to be an amalgamation of Nebuchadnezzar and Nabonidus.
So what does this have to do with Deism?
as the Bible says
let us hear the conclusion
“fear God and keep his commandments”
especially
do not seethe a kid in his mothers milk
yes , that really is a commandment !
seriousley tho,
let’s all just admit that
WE JUST DON”T KNOW
life is a mystery that soon becomes history !
uhhhh……….
what?
Well my Deist friend, this is your Shamanistic Pal John, and letting you know I’m now on Religious Freaks. Also to say I never realized that even what I thought was just a simple concept as Deism could be so diversified. Plus I must complete you excellent wording for a basic but well explained base of Deism.
Lastly, I have pretty simple question. While it is my understanding that some Deist put stock in sections of the bible. What would you consider the general story of Divine Creation as outlined in Genesis. I am talking about BOTH creation stories. Or do those fall under the aspect of Miracles?
I am a Deist, senior, gay man who believes wholeheartedly that a “higher-power” created the universe and all that is involved in it, then stepped back and allowed the ‘reason’ and ‘common sense’ instilled in each of us take over. This allows us the right of choice, something Christianity doesn’t adhere to. The god of the bible commits dispicable atrocities over and over, yet we are taught to adore and worship him, or deny him, and burn in hell. Some choice.
As a law-abiding, hard-workong, tax-paying citizen who strives to be the best I can be, finds that it is no ones business what I do in the privacy of my bedroom (save the partner I am with)as long as we are consenting adults and practice safe-sex.
If I had children, the last book I would ever encourage them to read would be the bible. It is full of dispicable acts, most of which are performed by “God”…demons, demon possession…I could go on and on but if any doubts the assertions, read it for yourself.
Well, I would say that both reason and commons sense are in rahter short supply at the moment.
Also, I would advice everyone to read the bible at a later age. I think it is important for people to know what others believe in and why. The bible also plays an important role in western litterature and is rather important for understanding our history.
I agree that it’s not a book one should read to their 6 year old children, but it is definatly something everyone should read for themselves (meaning: outside of church) at a somewhat later age.
Of course, ther is the fact that I don’t think any information concerning anything (bar some extremes) should be withheld from anyone, but that is beside the point.
Hello, What are the values, rituals, and beliefs when it comes to death and afterlife among this religion?
Hello Ashley,
Sadly, I believe that Humanistic Jones has moved on to other discussion boards. Also, I don’t think he’s a deist anymore.
Since I am a deist of sorts, I’ll try to answer the question in his stead. The highest value for deist is rationality. Deists place reason and evidence above all else. Their main belief is that reason is the best way to understand the universe. They also believe that the existence of God can be demonstrated through the use of reason. From this, they conclude that reason is God’s greatest gift after, perhaps, existence.
There are no rituals. Beliefs about the afterlife are not uniform across all deists. Since there is no reason to conclude that there is an afterlife, most simply hope that God will surprise us. Other’s are convinced that there is definitely an afterlife. Still others, like myself, find the existence of an afterlife to be so improbable as to be impossible in all practicality.
I hope this answers your questions. Let me know if you have any follow-up ones.
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actually liked the post that you wrote . it really is not that simple to find great stuff toactually read (you know READ and not just browsing through it like some uniterested and flesh eating zombie before going somewhere else), so cheers mate for really not wasting my time on the god forsaken internet. :D