The infamous Kids on Fire summer camp in North Dakota, made infamous by the movie Jesus Camp, has been officially shut down (for now). The camp’s director, Becky Fischer, said the movie Jesus Camp sparked such outrage that she feared for her safety and that of the kids attending the camp.
Last October, after the film’s release, the camp was hot by vandals who caused $1,500 in damage. Fischer even asked the distributors of "Jesus Camp" not to release the film in Bismarck for fear of reprisal from locals.
While I don’t condone violence against this camp or its patrons, I am very glad to see this freak show closed down. The harm done to these kids is far greater than the $1,500 worth of damage on the campground.
I’d like to hear from everyone on this. Christians, from what you know about this camp, are you glad it’s closed? As for you Atheists, you’re going to hell anyway so don’t bother commenting ;)
Also, if you’ve seen the movie please share your thoughts. And if you’ve been to the camp or know someone that has, please contact me.
Thanks to Humanistic Jones for the tip.
Related posts:
- Camp Out–Where It’s Ok To Drop The Soap
- My Kid Is Going To Jesus Camp!
- The Evolution Of Summer Camp
- Jesus Freaks–The Documentary
- Charles Darwin One-Ups Jesus
November 10th, 2006 at 12:40 pm
Don’t like the idea of such a camp myself, but threatening the camp with destruction might not be the best way to say that you have a healthy alternative…
Never mind. After reading that article, if they are going to blatantly try to enforce such ideas without giving the option of choice, let it be done with. I’ll take vandalism over that.
November 10th, 2006 at 12:46 pm
But now where will our children go to be dressed up in camo to do batton and rifle drills to songs about the end of the world?
November 10th, 2006 at 12:47 pm
$1500 in damages? Those are some piss-poor vandals I could do that alone in 15 minutes. Obviously North Dakota has a deficit of disaffected teens. Not that I condone that type behavior.
November 10th, 2006 at 2:06 pm
That’s odd, she knew everyone was going to ‘dislike’ what’s going on there, and even fears for her live because of it, but still continues…
Either she’s very faithfull and sure of herself OR (more likely) INCREADIBLE NAIVE AND IGNORANT.
“”$1500 in damages? Those are some piss-poor vandals. Not that I condone that type behavior.”"
Depends on the target…. :P
November 10th, 2006 at 2:07 pm
The idea of a Christian camp per se isn’t a bad one. I worked at one and it was a beneficial experience. It wasn’t at all militant as this one appears to be though. If it’s a tenth as bad as it appears then I’m glad it’s gone.
November 10th, 2006 at 2:30 pm
Well, thats some good news…We need that in this blog :).
Gasmonso: what’s up with the google ads? I think they are definately the most badly targeted ads I have seen by google.
I guess The Google System cannot distinguish sarchasm…
November 10th, 2006 at 3:32 pm
The disconnect between the ads and the site content is one of the main reasons for reading this blog.
November 10th, 2006 at 3:56 pm
The greatest add irony was when someone posted debunking all the groups selling miracle water. The google ad in their post? Lourdes Miracle Water!
November 10th, 2006 at 4:04 pm
I saw the movie and when I wasn’t laughing at the absurdities, I was horrified by mental trauma these kids were being put through.
I’m ecstatic that the camp will be closed. I hope it was the outrage from the country more than the vandalism that closed it though. I despise vandalism.
November 10th, 2006 at 4:53 pm
closing this camp will do nothing. as long as people feel the need to put their kids through this, they will find a way to do it. i just hope that the movie provides a different perspective to these people. kinda like when you get drunk, do stupid things, and see a video of it the next day.
November 10th, 2006 at 8:58 pm
Hehehe…. drunk.
November 11th, 2006 at 10:53 am
Facts 1 and 2:
1.) Film is released to an uproar of scoffing, laughter, and alarm ranging across the country before it even reaches all of it’s target release areas.
2.) Haggard, a prominant evangelist leader !!!***WHO APPEARS IN THE FILM BASHING GAYS***!!!, leads and represents over 30 million people, and talks regularly with president Bush and his advisors, gets himself into a scandal involving hard drugs and hard gayness which ALSO gains nationwide scoffing, laughter, and alarm.
3.) Facts 1 + 2 = 3. Because of points 1 and two, the film is basicly in a position to compromise the entire evangelical movement in the eyes of the public.
Given 1 2 and 3, it seems a bit strange when suddenly the filmmakers pull the film from showing anymore, citing vandalism of the camp itself as the reason. I’m not saying they did it themselves, but damn… the timing and the nature of the incident was pretty damn conveniant for them. They get to save some face while blaming the hatred of the world and have all the more reason to continue to espouse their philosophy. Praise God!
Also, there were remote controlled vans driven into Jesus camp towers one and two so they could blame it on atheists. Hehe. :p
November 13th, 2006 at 4:35 pm
Boris beat me to it! The kind of person that would send their kids to this place to be abused, will proceed to abuse their kids anyway. At least this way it is open to public scrutiny.
Uh oh, I feel a typical Michael tactless statement coming on! I don’t think childbearing should be a right. It should be a privilege. There are just too darn many stupid people out there reproducing, and unfortunately the kids are the ones hurt. Typically, stupid people produce stupid offspring! This is not to say there aren’t exceptions both ways, but in general my experience bears this out. I do not believe general stupidity is in any way a genetic thing, I believe it is 100% learned and they learn it from their stupid parents. At the very least they aren’t given the proper stimulus during their most formative stages, from birth to around 5 years old, because their moron parents don’t know they should be reading to their kids, letting them listen to music (and I don’t mean country music, that stuff probably does more harm than good), etc during that time. Then, they send them to places like this. Because they are too stupid to know they harm they cause.
That was just a setup for this statement though: I am almost convinced people should not be allowed to teach their kids organized religion until they are at least 16! Really, I am ->
November 13th, 2006 at 4:40 pm
Man! It lost 1/3rd of my post due to the visual aid I put in there, booo! I can’t even remember the rest of what I said now, but basically it was a long diatribe about how I feel most christians don’t believe in god because they believe, they do because their parents/priest/minister, whatever, told them thats what they believe at such a young age that they can no longer tell the difference. Most, more than likely all, christians will deny this but they are indoctrinated and their view is clouded anyway so what they said is immaterial :)
November 14th, 2006 at 3:53 pm
we need to make an evolution camp….
November 27th, 2006 at 12:26 pm
You asked anyone who has been to the camp to respond. I am Levi’s father, the boy highlighted in the film. I am also Rachael’s pastor, the one girl of two highlighted in the film. I am not a typical pastor… I have an engineering degree. We have never said we liked the film. We have never endorsed it. There is so much in the film that demands context. For instance, my wife says to my son, “Did you read the part in the book where is says, ‘Science doesn’t prove anything.’?”, but you never hear the book explanation of that in the film. All the scenes where the audience is shown nodding heads or smiling or looking somber or whatever do not actually match what was happening when the speaker was speaking. All audience shots are suspect. We are attempting to put context to as much of the film as possible at http://www.jesuscampers.com and I am writing a book to enter the national dialogue on the movie. I am willing, as time allows, to discuss anything about the movie.
November 27th, 2006 at 2:44 pm
I don’t care how much of it was taken out of context. There is no context that would convince me that you people aren’t abusing your children. Do you think your child has formulated the decision to become an evangelical xian on his own? What would you do if your child displayed so much as an ounce of doubt about your particular faith?
What about the tirade against harry potter books? What possible context could make you look less crazy there?
November 28th, 2006 at 11:43 pm
aaron was wondering about an evolution camp?
In Richard Dawkins’ latest book, The God Delusion, he mentions Camp Quest, which is self-described as “the first residential summer camp in the history of the United States for the children of Atheists, Freethinkers, Humanists, Brights, or whatever other terms might be applied to those who hold to a naturalistic, not supernatural world view.”
http://www.camp-quest.org/
As for Jesus Camp, I’m pleased to hear that it is closed (for now). The psychological manipulation and abuse that went on at the camp (and in the children’s homes, as well) was disgusting. Words can’t do it justice, you need to see the movie.
December 1st, 2006 at 11:59 am
Dear Father Says…
If no amount of context will influence you, then you would be a close-minded person. I suspect, however, that you are open-minded. That is probably why the movie upset you, because you perceived the people in the movie as having no balance. The movie made us concerned also, because it does not represent us.
My son Levi barely knows what the word evangelical is supposed to mean. It is a word used in circles where everyone has to have a label, but it is not one used very often in our Christianity. Levi has experienced God in his own right. He does not want to be a preacher or pastor as some news has stated. He wants to be a doctor. My children go through the high and lows of living just like anyone else. Living is full of victories, doubts, triumphs and confusion. My oldest child… my daughter, believes many of the things I hold dear, but she has also taken a different path on certain issues. We have a great relationship and she is a model of independent thinking.
Becky declares in the movie that “in Old Testament times Harry Potter would have been killed as a warlock.†She was not advocating violence against anyone. I know her personally and she would never do that. None of the kids where confused on that note. I’ve talked to her personally about her statement. She regrets saying it and thinks it is a distraction in the film. She isn’t at war against Harry Potter or the books. Neither is my family. I think she was trying to let kids know that if they read Harry Potter and liked the stories that it was important for them not to get infatuated with witchcraft itself. She was letting them know that, biblically, witchcraft is not a God-thing. Witchcraft as part of fantasy stories is not a problem.
December 1st, 2006 at 12:03 pm
The above note is mine. Jesus Camper and Tim O’Brien are the same person.
December 1st, 2006 at 3:47 pm
Tim,
For myself, I could, theoretically, change my mind about the camp and about the parent-child interactions I saw repeatedly throughout the movie.
I guess if you were to show me the (non-existent) outtakes from the film, where the adults in attendance told the children that what was about to happen might be scary but it was only an act, just make-believe, and not to take it seriously because it’s just so they can make a silly movie… and then afterward calmed the children and apologized to them for making them endure that horrendous torment, and explained that they didn’t mean any of it, etc…
Yeah, that would probably change my opinion. I would, of course, still think that it is wrong to make children unnecessarily endure such things.
Otherwise, the film seems to show, in scene after brutal scene, a process of systematic manipulation of young children based primarily upon ignorance, prejudice and especially fear (with the occasional carrot-reward, of course, as all such systems employ). At the camp, the kids are repeatedly made to engage in group activities designed to break down individual will — classic “brainwashing” techniques. Becky admits as much (brainwashing, not abuse) in the film, on camera.
At other times, Becky tells the children that her goal is to create Soldiers for Christ who are willing to lay down their lives for the cause. It is very clear that she isn’t saying, “you should dedicate your lives to this,” but is literally encouraging them to (be willing to) die for the cause (to fight abortion, spread jeezus, etc). When I heard her saying it, I couldn’t help but think of suicide bombers and jihadists, only they’d have crosses around their necks. The Jesus Jihad? Jihadis for Jesus?
Fiat Luminosus!
(Let there be Brights!)
December 1st, 2006 at 11:25 pm
I think the very fact that such crazed people can rise up out of the evangelical movement is alarming enough. The movement nurtured this and it doesn’t matter how much common sense and respect for critical thinking the rest of evangelicals may or may not have. The fact remains that the supposedly “balanced” people in the movement are referred to as such because they have a semblance of rational thinking that prevents them from going overboard. Imagine the damage that would be done if philosophy, logic, critical thinking, and science were not around to temper these people. I can tell you with great certainty that we would be looking at the dark ages. What you don’t seem to get is that many of us so-called free thinkers fear that this is exactly what is going to happen because of evangelicals (and the numerous other groups of fundamentalists of various religions). From all indications, it has already begun and is only going to get worse unless people can be startled into waking up to the idiocy the evangelical movement promotes.
The movement itself has become a staple source of support and revenue for ambitious political leaders and people who are just generally greedy. They are able to capitalize on the movement because of it’s follower’s will easy accept anyone who can fake their spirituality well enough. People are well aware of this, yet the problem remains.
Unfortunately, nothing can undo the damage at this point. However, something must be done and nothing short of exposing the evangelical movement for the beast it truly is is going to stop the problem. I know it’s hard to hear that because a lot of people within the movement have really good intentions, but that cannot be treated as an viable excuse. The evangelical movement is responsible for the hampering of scientific progress, the censoring of learning materials, and the persecution of minorities. This is just for starters. I could go on for a long time on the subject in great detail. The point here is that the time for apologies and reassurances has long since passed. Now is the time for change. If we ignore that, we do so only to our own detriment.
January 30th, 2007 at 4:31 pm
I saw the movie last night and was so angry by what I saw.
I found it funny how she compared what she was doing to these kids with the training of terrorists overseas. Hmmm… Ok that must make it ok then if the terrorists are doing it. Yes kids are very impressionable when young but that is all the more reason we should not take advantage of them. I have been conflicted by the amount of political influence my church has had on its members but seeing what was being said in the film is really disturbing. I see some dark days ahead of us. We already have seen what blindly following a supposed evangelical christian can do to a country(Bush). Its time Christians wake up and remember that Jesus didn’t try changing the government when he was on earth, he just showed love to everyone and that was all that is needed for the world to become a better place.
April 5th, 2007 at 10:42 pm
I just finished watching Jesus Camp after a friend recommended it to me and was moved to superimpose Becky Fischer’s face on an old communist propaganda poster and e-mail it to everyone in my address book. The woman acts like a dictator! Years ago I told my mother that the Evangelical denomination scared me due to the fact that they had the making of an extremist fundamentalist group and were taking over a majority of the country’s religious population, and that they, unlike all other religions, denounce people who worship the same god as they do. This film shook me to my core at how much they have progressed in just a few years; and now they are taking hold of the government! It scares me most that it resembles the way the Nazi party seized control of the Reichstag in Germany. The primary reason they were able to gain control was that people dismissed them as a simple anti-semitic group with no political power until they slowly took over the government and elected Hitler to power. I’m glad something has been done to stop this brainwashing and building of “god’s army,” although I do not condone the violent acts that led to it. But, unfortunately, that isn’t enough to end the threat of an fundamentalist, Evangelically controlled government. Someone, especially other Christians, needs to stand up and defiantly declare, “We won’t let you continue to use God as a weapon” and end this madness before it spirals out of control and sparks religious warfare and events like that of the French Revolution and the Holocaust. We need to learn from the past and stop them before they go too far.
April 19th, 2007 at 4:41 pm
“I just finished watching Jesus Camp after a friend recommended it to me and was moved to superimpose Becky Fischer’s face on an old communist propaganda poster and e-mail it to everyone in my address book. The woman acts like a dictator!”
Skylar, I hope you realize that there was a “religion free” policy in basic communism. Also, it is an equality system, just nobody can understand that. There is no “leader.” Everybody is equal. There has been no true communism since government was created.
On topic though, even if you ignore my status as an Atheist, this movie literally made me want to find that camp and let them know just how insane they were making themselves look. This is just as bad as the Islamic extremist fundametalists who think they need to wipe out all the non-Islamic people in the world.
They are both saying they need to be “Soldiers,” whether it is for Allah or God. Both religions preach PEACE, LOVE, and ACCEPTANCE… so why use the term soldier? Why become so militant? Why so radical, when both religions speak about how you should be a humble, giving person?
Religions make no sense. :(
May 29th, 2007 at 12:19 pm
i just watched this movie and i am a catholic.
this does not reflect all christians. i am roman catholic, or as they described in the movie, on of those people who attend “dead churches”. they are episcopal, way different.
they believe only “born again” people can go to heaven and we believe in universal salvation, or if you are a good person you will go to heaven no matter what religion or race you are. this movie reflects EXTREMEISTS. its sad for people to have twisted ideas about a religion that, yes, has flaws in the system, but also brings love and unity amoung people.
what shocked me the most was about them praying for president bush. its good to pray someone makes a good disicion but to pray to a cardboard replica? i dont think so. he meets with that pastor every monday???
i was shocked, and less than pleased.
-laura
May 29th, 2007 at 2:35 pm
i dont think anyone thinks that what a normal christian is like. all my family are methodists and i am always suprised how openminded they are. But the fact is these people get the most attention, and they should because frankly they need to be wiped out, interpret that however you like.
July 5th, 2007 at 1:39 pm
First of all, I’m agnostic. I am not of any religion, and am still searching for one to satisfy my needs. Therefore I feel as I have the right to respond to such a comment.
This camp is one of the most outrageous things I have ever seen. Not just the camp, but the kids too. The kid with the rat-tail was talking about how it’s only warmed up 0.6C within 5 years or something. He probably doesn’t know that it’s only warmed up 6C since the Ice Age. The main thing that bothers me is that the kids don’t know their facts, or even the whole story.
This entire movie is proof of self-serving bias and group polarization (basic behavioral psychology). They don’t believe in anything anyone else says, they take all blame for their successes (a generic one being getting rid of Muslims, although that’s not in the movie), and their views are strengthened by the camp (ie the kids crying because of their sins and forever accepting this “god” person into their lives).
It just really bothers me to see this type of brainwashing going on. These radicals are the main reason I hate religions. Nearly all beliefs force you to say that yours is the only correct one. So there are about 30 correct religions, and all of them are wrong due to each other… it’s a mess. That’s all religion is. A giant mess.
July 24th, 2007 at 12:26 pm
[...] just read here that the camp is closed down fearing the kids [...]
August 12th, 2007 at 12:09 am
aww, I love Evangelofascists, why’d they have to go and close it down
October 6th, 2007 at 11:02 pm
I’d say its a form of child abuse. The movie scared me, and I felt sad for the children being brought up to believe such extreme views, without a chance to see the outside world and other veiws (note that the kids they interviewed were all in homeschooling) It’s sad that doing this to children is legal, but religion will always be a very contriversial debate. I am only 16 and I can tell you I was taught very minimal religion as a child and I can now become whatever religion I want if I chose, I do not think that my foster parents would say anything.
December 29th, 2007 at 7:50 pm
this is my favorite movie of all time, it just shows how poweful and unconventional God can be with little to no money….i am an evangelist covered in tats and a testimony designed to overcome the devil..i been delivered straight from the mental ward to authority in Christ by choosing his will over my own….i been on the lost’s side and utterly selfish and perverted most my life and now i am very powerfully moved in the spirit by these people simply trying their hardest for Jesus….it’s easier to be against it then for it, and there’s an example of the truth rite there…i dont know anybody that really digs the movie as i….all i gotta say is wide is the path to destruction….and by the way God showed me a vision of hell on pcp, no one in their right mind can fathom it or wants to taunt it…..Life is like a beast, u play with it, and play with it, and then one day it bites u….helping u appreciate it all the more….and then there will prolly still be alot of folx burning and yet STILL in denial at the same time….what can ya do….GODBLESS EM…..PEACE AND JESUS CHRIST YA’LL….GOD’Z THE MOST GANGSTER.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:46 am
I think the movie is great to. It made me laugh a lot harder then Epic Movie did.
I wanted to taunt your preaching more, but i’ve decided to go argue with my wall instead, It’ll have more effect.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:27 pm
[...] The name does raise a few eyebrows, doesn’t it? From what I’ve read, the camp was closed down about a year ago because “the movie Jesus Camp sparked such outrage that [Becky Fischer] [...]
January 1st, 2008 at 10:03 pm
That is frankly the scariest thing that I have ever seen. Those kids have been brainwashed out of their minds. Like skylar said, this is what lead up to the Holocaust, and before people knew it, they had been taken over by extreme radicals. These kids will be strongly encouraged to go into politics and control our nation until all common sense is lost. This movie reminded me of Borat, because in both movies they filmed people’s real opinions. I highly doubt that the people in the camp would “pretend” to believe, judging by the fact that they seemed to be ready to kill an abortionist. Shutting it down was a good decision.
May 7th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
i couldn’t entirely tell what the movie makers were trying to get at, like, what was their stance
June 2nd, 2008 at 11:36 am
That’s right! A-man! Tell the truth. All those crazy Christians know the truth deep down! There wasn’t some brilliant mastermind behind all of this. We all know that a supernatural all knowing god doesn’t make any sense.
What really happened was that an itty bitty partical that came from somewhere and was floating in something blew up some time for some reason and a mess of stuff came out. That stuff condensed somehow into something that eventually cooled off into a ball of dust with water on it. Then lightning struck the water and made some soup that the fish came out of. Any rational person knows that cousin flipper grew some legs and decided to crawl out of that dang water.
THEN he climed in a tree and became a chimp. THEN the chimp start going bald and decided to walk on land because he was self conscious about his little hair problem. One day he came up with a bunch of ideas…tools, music, art, oh and god too. That’s how we got religion. All of us good ole athiests, the Christians, Jews, etc. all come from the dot that made the sun that spit out the earth that had the water that got hit with the bolt that spontaneously generated the cell that made the fish that swung from the vine and became Darwin! The other ideas are silly. It’s so simple why don’t these folks get it?
BTW…”we need to make an evolution camp”…we have those already. They’re called public schools.