In a recent interview for the Observer Music Monthly Magazine, Sir Elton John decrees that organized religion should be banned outright. Sir Elton, a flamboyant homosexual, says that religion promotes hatred and spite towards gays. Elton continued to say that he was very fond of the teachings of Jesus that he learned as a child in Sunday school. But he believes that reality doesn’t reflect those teachings anymore when he said,
But the reality is that organized religion doesn’t seem to work. It turns people into hateful lemmings and it’s not really compassionate.
After 9/11, Sir Elton had called for religious leaders from all faiths to hold a conclave and discuss the fate of the world. He noted,
We are all God’s people; we have to get along and the [religious leaders] have to lead the way. If they don’t do it, who else is going to do it? They’re not going to do it and it’s left to musicians or to someone else to deal with it.
While many find Sir Elton to be over-the-top, I find it difficult to disagree. Religious leaders have failed on several fronts. They have done little to control the amount of fanaticism. They have failed to keep open dialogues with leaders of different faiths. But most importantly, I believe that the leaders have strayed off the path terribly. They do not focus on the original teachings of their religion. Instead, most have focused on the hate and less on the forgiveness.
Christianity today does not resemble what the original teachings of Jesus were. The focus is now on anti-gay, anti-abortion, anti-stem-cell, and anti-anything else they can think of. Gone are the days of preaching love, compassion, understanding, acceptance, and forgiveness. This holds true for Islam, Christianity, and Judaism.
Instead of rallying millions of followers to eradicate hunger, poverty, and disease, we see these religions fighting each other to win as if it were some sort of contest. But there are no winners; just losers and we quickly create divides between one another and create more animosity.
While I don’t agree with Sir Elton on banning religion (just look at Russia), I do agree with him calling for more communication. It is the responsibility of all major religious leaders to work together and find the common ground that binds us. After all, aren’t we all God’s children supposedly?
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“”Elton John decrees that organized religion should be banned outright.”"
I’ve been saying that for years, but now that he says it, it’s news? bah… :P
seriously, we would be better off with people spending their time on something Actaully usefull, instead of ‘appear usefull’
“”Instead of rallying millions of followers to eradicate hunger, poverty, and disease, we see these religions fighting each other to win as if it were some sort of contest. “”
QFT, or, if you will, AMEN!
ps. why is there an add saying
“We are all his children and He will not abandon any to an eternal hell
http://www.UniversalistChristians.org”
Right next a picture of bin laden???
Also, Elton John:
+1
Religion:
still 0
The problem is Elton and most others fail to realize that if you’re not making your group feel superior to another group people stop showing up, that hurts the bottom line. Which is the real reason for religion, money and power.
The reason he is calling for it that he is part of a persecuted minority, not that he feels religion itself is a bad thing. Thus, I would have to disagree with his reasoning even if I agree with his sentiment.
Dave
Didn’t the Pope already make a call for dialogue? That one didn’t turn out so well…
So long as there are fanatics controlling the voice of organized religion, there will be no chance for reconciliation. Pointing out their hypocracy doesn’t seem to do much good, either, as many Muslims have demonstrated with the same example I used above. I don’t think it’s exclusive to Islam, either. Too many fundamentalist Christians refuse to listen to anyone, as do many Jews (I don’t know much about other ‘non-book’ religions). Since they are the ones that yell the loudest, they become the representatives of their respective religions, no matter how many well-meaning religious individuals there are. This fight isn’t about religions themselves, in my opinion. It’s about the mindset of the people involved with them, or at least the most active ones. Until we find a way to change it, any chance of peace is near impossible.
Sir Elton think he can solve this prob. Thats a great idea, let him try it
Well if he tries, that will at least be someone trying to do something about it. I don’t see religious leaders admiting their wrongs and opening up to the idea that you can’t just dismiss someone because they don’t agree with you anytime soon.
“Religious leaders have failed”
What do you expect? Each one of them think the absolute Truth is on their side!
If only his music was as good as his assessment of organized religion.
“”So long as there are fanatics controlling the voice of organized religion, there will be no chance for reconciliation.”"
Which is always. As the leaders are the ones most fervently religious.
Never thought I would say this, but… Elton John has a good point. While is call for organized religion (notice the organized there) to be banned is sensationalist, I am sure he is fully aware of that and said it like that for a reason. Organized religion is the bane of the modern world. In my opinion it is the greatest threat to modern humanity. I said it that way as a snub to the republican woman who somewhat recently said that about homosexuality.
To think god, if there is such a creature (I personally do not believe so) cares one iota about whether you get your jollies with a man or a woman is laughable. He is right, most of the dogma coming from churches are nothing but hate filled garbage. Look at those westboro (however you spell it, I can’t even be bothered to look it up, and I am a spelling nazi) psychos. Fred Phelps and his mob. While I don’t think they are representative of organized religion, they are guaranteed to NOT be the only ones that think like that. I bet if you were to get a list of every church in the USA, especially the south, and a bigotry score for each one, you would be shocked.
Disclaimer: I live in the south. Jacksonville, Florida to be exact. While Florida is not always considered part of the south when discussing this sort of thing, at the very least Jacksonville is. It is dominated by a monolithic church (First Baptist of Jacksonville) right in the center of down town Jacksonville. They even have a lighthouse they built with the money the poor saps in this town gave them. I get the biggest laugh every time I drive by it. I am going to get a picture and send it to Gas so he can post it!
Disclaimer 2: I am not a persecuted minority. I am a straight white male. Oh, well I am also an Atheist, so I guess some might call that a persecuted minority. Though, I think we do more than our fair share of persecution to be honest. But hell, the christians are the ones that set themselves up to be a persecuted majority. How does that happen? Oh yea, they are a bunch of wierdos that like to let one whacko think for them. Thats how it happens.
Ok, I am done rambling aimlessly now.
Fanatics controlling the voice of organized religion? Hardly. Moderates do and they foster an environment conducive to fanaticism. Worst yet, the mainstream religious give, at least, tacit approval to henious acts committed in the name of religion. If you disagree, read The God Delusion by Richard Dawkins (the whole of chapter nine or skip directly to page 301) or The End of Faith by Sam Harris for a crystal clear explanation.
Many people would consider Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris fanatics, including atheists, so you have to take those particular authors with a grain of salt (although I do in fact agree with much of what they say).
My point was this: it seems like the majority of people I meet who are religious don’t scream at me that I will burn in hell. They rarely even bring it up. I believe that in religion, much like in politics, most people really just want to go on their way and stay out of the fire, so to speak. As far as allowing the fanatics free reign, yes, they do that in a passive sense by not actively stopping them, but can you blame them? Moderates are generally people who wouldn’t want a major conflict, and to challenge the fanatics would result in being loudly (perhaps violently) rejected from the system. Ask any Russian fans of democracy during Stalin’s time. On the other hand, the extremists tend to project their ideas onto everything they touch, with the result that the greater belief system is associated with them. So the system is controlled by fanatics because while the Pope is technically leader of the Catholic Church and generally considered one of the most important figures in Christian religion, I hear a lot more from Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell. To get more use out of my example in the last post, the Pope asked for communication, not direct action. I doubt he’s out to get us. The fanatic Muslims who killed people and burned cars, however, became greater representatives of the violence issue than a quote from a Byzantine emperor.
Sure, Harris and Dawkins are more extreme (and consistent) in their views than a lot of a-religious people. But as far as many people calling them fanatics, first off I don’t really give a damn what ‘many people’ say. You won’t find truth through democracy, and as far as opinion all you’ll find is the lowest common denominator. But more importantly, from what I’ve heard I’d much rather have Dawkins or Harris disagree with me than a Falwell or some other such fanatic. Maybe it’s just because they don’t have such a following, but so far I haven’t heard anything nastier than the child abuse comment.
Don’t take their books with a grain of salt because a lot of people don’t like what they say. Take them with a grain of salt because you’re a good skeptic with a brain of your own.
You realise evolution, non-earth-centric universe, atoms and most things going against current mainstream culture seemed like fanatism from the people saying it…
A-religionism isn’t fanatical, it’s the ‘We MUST respect religion’ that is fanatic.
“”A-religionism isn’t fanatical, it’s the ‘We MUST respect religion’ that is fanatic.”"
indeed, but to add to that, religion in itself is not fanatical. By itself, religion would be respected, were it not for those ‘forcing’ you to become a member of whatever cult they follow. It is only BECAUSE of those who go around screaming ‘respect my beliefs or burn in hell’ or even worse ‘follow my beliefs or butn in hell’ that religion is NOT always respected, rediculed and those who go around preaching it hated by a large a group.
It’s a self-denieing-prophecy.
Not really much to say here besides that I’m totally disapointed in all of you.
Not that it matters one whit to me why, but I must confess to curiosity. Why, pray tell, are you so disappointed in all of us?
For so openly bashing religion and therefore wearing down the credibility of the so-called “free thinkers”, like a bull headed for a red cape instead of the matador.
… my point being that religion has little to nothing to do with the real problem. Perhaps bashing is the wrong term; ‘targeting’ or ‘focusing on’ would be more appropriate.
To the inevitable question of what the real problem is as I see it: human nature, or rather the predatory nature of a certain subtype of humans, and the consequences of a large body of easy prey being cultivated and exploited by them.
To the inevitable question of what the real problem is as I see it: human nature, or rather the predatory nature of a certain subtype of humans, and the consequences of a large body of easy prey being cultivated and exploited by them.
The problem then is that these people are going to be preyed on all the time. It would be those with the higher predatory nature that use the facilities of organized religion to get their’s. Its like Communism, it only works if people are saints. The physical facades of religion will continue to fleece their people and drive them against each other, all while twisting their once philosopical messages into rallying cries and battle calls.
Human nature is the problem, and humans created religion. We’ve created alot of things that aren’t good for us, and we’ve outlawed or regulated them being used in places where large numbers of people could be hurt by them. Religion is no different in my opinion.
I agree. Well said.
Arktis Says:
November 14th, 2006 at 10:14 am
For so openly bashing religion and therefore wearing down the credibility of the so-called “free thinkersâ€, like a bull headed for a red cape instead of the matador.
———
The problem is, religion leaves itself so open to “bashing”. Also, there are a LOT more “religious” people than there are non-religious, so it is a really big target. It is also one of the few social constructs that make it ok to do terrible things under the guise of saintliness. (is that even a real word?) For instance, just look at the religious agenda against homosexuality here in the US. Whether you agree with this comparison or not, I feel it is valid. Lets just substitute gays with say interracial relationships (this is not as much a stretch as you may think) Suppose the bible says it is sinful to have, or is interpreted to say, interracial relationships (actually, this may be buryed in there somewhere) so they mount a crusade to make it illegal for a black and a white to be married. Is that any more wrong than the crusade to “define” marriage as between a man and a woman? Any less wrong?
My POINT is that religion gives people justifications to infringe upon peoples rights wholesale, it gives people justifications to do horrendous things to other people. I should NOT even have to cite examples for this one.
So, YES. I am, and will continue to, bashing ORGANIZED religion. I have nothing at all against religion, I just choose to not participate, and I think they are a little looney. However, I have never been bothered by a wiccan. Nor a buddist. But those damn christians INSIST on coming to my door every frigging saturday. They also INSIST on saying my brother (who is gay) can not get married to whoever the heck he wants when it is absolutely NONE of their business. None.
“”, I have never been bothered by a wiccan. Nor a buddist. But those damn christians INSIST on coming to my door every frigging saturday. They also INSIST on saying my brother (who is gay) can not get married to whoever the heck he wants when it is absolutely NONE of their business. None.”"
QFT. so maybe you should redifine it as “continue to bash christians, muslims and other religions like them”
Why would I bother? No, I will continue to bash religion in general since 1) None of it makes sense to me and 2) the vast majority (and I do mean VAST) are of the organized sort and organized religion is the problem.
Get too many of them together in one place and they think they can better the world in the name of their one true god (or gods in the case of the Hindu, etc).
By the way, I have no idea what QFT stands for since I avoid “internet slang” like the plague it is. This is assuming it is some sort of internet slang. If not, I still have no idea what it means.
I would assume QFT is “Quick F-ing Thought”
As long as religions keeps trying to force their fairy tale on the masses irrespective of what we want then they should be bashed. When god appears as withstands scientific scrutiny then s/he/it gets consideration until then I wish his followers would STFU
“It is the responsibility of all major religious leaders to work together and find the common ground that binds us. After all, aren’t we all God’s children supposedly?”
I disagree with you on this one, gasmonso.
The very point of this “common ground” is what we call in French “laïcité”. The translation is “secularity”, but it conveys more than that.
A “common ground” must put aside what is not common, i.e. religion and personal beliefs. This common ground is necessary so that the same law and regulations can be applied to each inhabitant in a nation, righteously, without prejudice. Then, what is not common (i.e. religion) becomes /private/, and must NOT be brought to the public place: in the street, in public offices, in political decisions.
The clear separation of what is common to humans (which leads to more serene laws) from what is private or personal (religion) is what people such as Victor Hugo have fought for in France, for instance. This is the one major point in favour of the separation of church and state.
And we, the people, cannot, absolutely must not let religious leaders meddle into this.
Calling atheists fanatics or extremists is no different than deriding someone for stating that “1 + 1 = 2” or that “New Zealand is in the southern hemisphere.” Being an extremist is not fundamentally wrong. Consider the role of a scientist. Having such an attitude about discovering the truth through inquiry is commendable while proclaiming the truth wih no evidence at all (or even to the contrary) is madness.
Elton John is a very good musician and has been my idol ever since.,-:
Elton John is actually a living legend, what a great musical artist he is.*;`
elton john is already a living legend with his great musics`*.
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the music of elton john has this unique beat and the lyrics are very sentimental~,`
sir Elton John is one of the best singers that i know of, great voice and great compositions’”,
elton john can be only be the best singer and composer that i know. i like the song Candle In The Wind ~,*
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