i’d love to see some ultra-orthodox jews get a bitch slap from some bearded ayatollahs, or perhaps mormons vs christian evangelicals. im surprised that in a country that can spawn shows like ‘flamethrower’ and the UFC that this hasnt been thought of already! we’d need to keep buddhist monks out of it though, ive seen their shaolin moves that would make a complete mockery of it all.
(though as far as ‘religions’ go, buddhism seems to be the least offensive and not requiring faith or belief in fairytales about supernatural beings)

Steve, it sounds like you didn’t read the article in Haaretz. Let me provide you the briefest of highlights:

“Shear says that on the bus three weeks ago, she was slapped, kicked, punched and pushed by a group of men who demanded that she sit in the back of the bus with the other women…. ‘Four men surrounded me and slapped my face, punched me in the chest, pulled at my clothes, beat me, kicked me. My snood [hair covering] came off. I was fighting back and kicked one of the men in his privates. I will never forget the look on his face.’”

This is a group of men who are willing, on a moment’s notice, to beat the living shit out of woman on a public bus because she refused to go along with their religiously-based misogyny.

For Steve, a brutal group-attack against a 50-year-old woman is “inappropriate.” How would YOU describe such behavior?

Clearly a huge mistake on my part, and I once again humbly apologize.

Sorry for mistaking you for him.

It disturbs me. You disturb me.

As to your post: If religious people feel persecuted, it is usually because of one of two things.

1.) Another religious group with different beliefs is genuinely persecuting them.

2.) Good sense has tried to place a limit on how far they are allowed to go, and they cry foul.

Both are examples of the reasoning behind not giving any group too much free reign. Placing limits on a group is especially important when independent thought is discouraged within said group. Such as YOURS.

It wouldn’t be such a problem if your ilk were more prone to being rational. Unfortunately you are willing to go so far as to disgust distort and disturb in order to advance yourselves upon others.

http://www.thejewishweek.com/news/newscontent.php3?artid=13435

The bill is actually quite consistent with the anti Jewish/religious sentiments of many posting on this and similar lists and reflects the disdain that some secular Israelis have for Judaism. I would be amazed and disturbed were it to pass. The secular Israelis apparently fear that these encounters will ignite the “spark of a Jew” that exists in their children but they have been apparently trying to extinguish.

R Lee Smith

Since you like to focus on weird negative things about Judaism (sort of the “dog bites man” syndrome I thought I would give you a few positive things that just poped up, to help start of the new year. Here is an interesting article about how we Jews invented basketball:

http://www.thejewishweek.com/news/newscontent.php3?artid=13480

and here is an interesting project to help the Mayan Indian (they are producing all sorts of things including some specifically Jewish):

http://www.thejewishweek.com/news/newscontent.php3?artid=13452

Happy Jan 1

R Lee Smith

In terms of the backlash & the overall philosophy of the charedi community, I don’t think they are barbaric at all.

They are struggling to preserve a way of life. They are attempting to insulate their community from modern intrusions which they consider to be antithetical to Judaism.

Unfortunately in today’s society that has become increasingly difficult.

The vast vast majority of Charedim would be comparable to the Amish rather than the Taliban. There are a few crazies that seem to be getting the attention lately.

I think that because they feel under attack by the secular Israeli culture & have been under attack for many years, more & more have become crazies.

Sort of reminds me of that old commercial against litter, where you had that old Native American (back then we called them Indians) seeing the litter with that tear in his eye. The Indians were here first & now are helpless to stop those that are ruining their land.

Well, Chareidim were in Israel first. There’s been a continuous Jewish presence in the Holy Land since Temple times. Chareidim began arriving in earnest beginning in the early 1800’s. Those that ended up establishing & controlling the state, secular anti-religious Jews, did not begin arriving until the beginning of the 20th century.

Chareidim feel as if they are up against a wall & so they are fighting back, often in inappropriate ways.

Just my opinion.

“their” refers to the ultra orthodox population. “reaction” refers to the so-called backlash Steve was talking about. The entire post was in direct response to Steve’s.

There’s also a larger picture, meaning that you could take what I said and easily apply it to other peoples. I’d think that to be obvious, though.

I don’t understand this bit. It wasn’t an individual, it was multiple individuals. The only individual involved was the lady, surely you can’t be referring to her reaction. The word “their” can refer to an individual and to a group right? So “their reaction” could be used to refer to that group of men. I am confused.